Imagine it will depend on how the team is performing and the style of play.
If 6th is where the club finishes though, and no trophy, then I dont blame some fans for being dissapointed.
-
The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...
Manager Thomas Frank
- Thread starter The Fighting Cock
- Start date
Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports
Imagine it will depend on how the team is performing and the style of play.
If 6th is where the club finishes though, and no trophy, then I dont blame some fans for being dissapointed.
Bang on. Well said
Because managers are based predominantly on league form and results, not on a cup. For valid and logical reasons which escape some people on here.
Ange did well league wise first season but we had a world class attacker producing world class numbers still in Son. We also had one match a week. It’s the kind of conditions Amorim will be judged on this season and it’s much easier.
Frank has Europe and no world class attacker, so will be judged differently. 5th is not a realistic thing to ‘expect’ in his circumstances. Not sure why we would have a god given right to finish ahead of United (for example) who were ahead of us last season + added Mbeumo, Cunha, Sesko.
Some of you really need to give up your cult leader and abandon the bad faith arguments. Ange was sacked due to a 38 point season. A cup didn’t save him because it was obvious that overall the footy was getting progressively worse and we were worse compared to our peers, our peers being English teams, not Bodo Glimt or Frankfurt.
TLDR - Ange fucking sucked, Frank has question marks but just got here, get over your Aussie obsession because he just got fucking sacked again.
Entirely depends on context that, finishing 6th and no trophy could mean you could get knocked out of all comps and still put in poor performances and finish 6th by the virtue of others also being inconsistent or...you could finish 6th but get to the FA Cup Final, go on a deep run in the CL put in good performances the fans can get behind and unlucky to drop points in matches for example.
If you finish strongly and you have a clear style of play then fans will get behind it and there's optimism for next season.
EDIT - lol Basically I'm just repeating what you said really
Someone needs to steal a Robbie Williams song.
We all need our good times singalong moment in the shelf bar.
Really doesn’t help the first one syllable word I think of that rhymes with Frank is not that positive.
Clearly to expand my vocabulary.
Bank
Tank
Shank
Hank
Crank
Sank
Yeah doesn't surprise me mate - Ange suits a certain type of supporter with his bullshit bluster and all or nothing style.
Unfortunately for the rest of us that managerial profile, philosophy, style whatever you wanna call it doesn't work at the top level and honestly I don't go as often as I used to anymore but I would not have been able to sit through the last year of league form.
How match going fans have dealt with everything we have been through since 2019 is beyond me tbh - they are amazing for doing it.
Frank needs patience and a season or two minimum to fix the squad and get us playing better, people thinking this can be done with any longevity within a dozen games with half a squad is beyond me.
He'd win a lot of fans by going for it in home matches, our home form is wretched and that's not all on him but it is his job to arrest that, if he setup with an intention to go for it he wouldn't half make his job much easier.
I saw a video going around on social media where we were on the attack against Utd with Xavi and no-one came to support him, instead of running ahead of him 3 of our players stayed behind him and the move broke down - this is that I'm talking about with intention, that's nothing to do with personnel.
Like most fanbases our fans are a bit weird like that, our fucking fans clapped the team off for camping on the half way line with 9 men against Chelsea and losing 4-1 to them because they saw the intention of going for it...ironically that bought Ange a whole load of time with the fanbase because fans resonate with it even if it was a batshit mental thing to do.
I saw a video going around on social media where we were on the attack against Utd with Xavi and no-one came to support him, instead of running ahead of him 3 of our players stayed behind him and the move broke down - this is that I'm talking about with intention, that's nothing to do with personnel.
Like most fanbases our fans are a bit weird like that, our fucking fans clapped the team off for camping on the half way line with 9 men against Chelsea and losing 4-1 to them because they saw the intention of going for it...ironically that bought Ange a whole load of time with the fanbase because fans resonate with it even if it was a batshit mental thing to do.
No idea why he hasnt played his 3-5-2. Squad is set up for it
The manager and coaches see these players on a day to day basis so maybe there is method in his madness and the personnel you’re referring to aren’t good enough.
Taking off Xavi at the weekend was clearly the right call when we then equalised and went 2-1 up.
Here’s an out there thought - maybe the manager has more of an idea what he’s doing than us arm chair coaches give him credit for?!
Presumably because we've been without CB cover for the vast majority of the season.
The manager and coaches see these players on a day to day basis so maybe there is method in his madness and the personnel you’re referring to aren’t good enough.
Taking off Xavi at the weekend was clearly the right call when we then equalised and went 2-1 up.
Here’s an out there thought - maybe the manager has more of an idea what he’s doing than us arm chair coaches give him credit for?!
Okay so without bias or blindness what was the method in starting with that left hand side when both of his subs actually combined to score both our goals?
It's not the first time he's taken off Xavi when we've needed a creator on the pitch either, that was just an example.
Yeah and the last line is fair but silly at the same time because we all question managers, that doesn't make us experts - we're just speculating...I mean let's not sit here and act like we haven't questioned professionals before because I know you have so...
Wondering if the injury situation, and the standard of players available, it's beneficial to go to a three at the back. Porro and Udogie are more than capable wing backs - maybe even bought for that role initially. It does mean cramming in Palhinha, Bergvall and Sarr (my first choice midfield three) with Kudus tucked in behind Tel, or whoever is up front, which has the potential to be quite congested.
It will afford one of van de Ven or Romero greater opportunity to maraud (or meander) forward with knowledge that they have cover.
Just can't see how the current situation is going to suddenly right itself, and by current situation, I mean our general lack of creativity and attacking impetus, which could be so much more potent even with injuries.
It will afford one of van de Ven or Romero greater opportunity to maraud (or meander) forward with knowledge that they have cover.
Just can't see how the current situation is going to suddenly right itself, and by current situation, I mean our general lack of creativity and attacking impetus, which could be so much more potent even with injuries.
Udogie is on the way back from several weeks out through injury, so I’d assume that’s why he didn’t start, especially as he started midweek and completed 73 minutes against Copenhagen. If he’s advised not to start Udogie by the medical team, Spence is the only real option at LB.Okay so without bias or blindness what was the method in starting with that left hand side when both of his subs actually combined to score both our goals?
It's not the first time he's taken off Xavi when we've needed a creator on the pitch either, that was just an example.
Yeah and the last line is fair but silly at the same time because we all question managers, that doesn't make us experts - we're just speculating...I mean let's not sit here and act like we haven't questioned professionals before because I know you have so...
Odobert also started midweek and played 80 minutes so I’d assume that’s also why he didn’t start, especially as he’s not the most robust of players.
Both Tel and Odobert have looked pretty pants in the Prem, so it’s not exactly like we’re inundated with elite options for the left hand side.
I’d envisage Odobert probably gets more starts going forward as he’s seemed to have been playing at a higher level the last couple of games.
Frank seems to be trying to manage and rotate the squad to avoid further injuries, but unfortunately the depth and quality aren’t there. It’s a balancing act between playing our best 11 into the ground or rotating the squad as he’s clearly been trying to do.
I was frustrated by that as well to be fair, couldn't understand it.
Whatever his reasoning was, it certainly wasn't evident in an obvious way.
You would like to think we'll see a lot more of Udogie and Odobert starting going forward.
We need to see a pretty regular 11 so they can build on developing relationships on the pitch.
I think he’s managing player’s minutes, nothing more than that.
I think that’s also why we’re seeing Xavi being taken off to prevent any injury late on in the game.
Happy to buy that and I agree that could have come into his thinking especially as we have a load of injuries right now.
But I'm not having this, he's been fit ALL season and if he can't hack two back to back 90 min matches especially before the International break then there's something seriously wrong with him or how he's being managed.
Odobert has been doing well recently and is starting to warm up, your argument would hold water if we had a viable alternative to play there but instead he plays 'Richy' who's been shit for the majority of the season, why?
Slight contradiction here when you just said that he's been pretty pants in the Prem and now you're saying this?
Maybe this is the case but playing your striker who has a pretty bad injury history in a position he isn't good at is more risky than playing a player who has barely played this season in his natural position.
Maybe he thought that Amorim was going to start with Mbuembo and Amad on the right and that was his counter, just get physical against them and stop them from playing? Sometimes you gotta stop thinking about the opposition and think about what you have in your disposal...
Odobert picked up a knock in the Monaco game. That's why he didn't feature at all against Everton and presumably at least partially why he played such limited minutes against Chelsea.
You might be right and Frank made a shit tactical decision to not start him, but if you actually look at his minutes post-Monaco they're pretty much what you'd expect for a player being eased in having his minutes managed to prevent reinjury which has obviously been a massive issue for us - and Odobert in particular - over the past year.
For all the complaints about Frank's style/tactics and whatnot, I do think he deserves credit for the way he's managed players minutes this season and balanced them across the whole squad (well...the players he's had available at least).
He was out for yonks last season with a major hamstring injury. That probably demands careful management going forward, the same as it would be for VDV. I dare say they are assessed by the medical team in the days after a game and they may have advised him not to start Odobert.
So who does he play there if he wants to rest Odobert? Richy played most of his time off the left at Everton and Tel has been pants.
How is that a contradiction? Odobert was not at it at the start of the season, but his form has improved recently, so I’d expect him to be played more going forward. You’re just being contrary!