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Manager Thomas Frank

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Are you Frank Out or In?

  • Total voters
    623
Reluctantly, I’ve changed my vote from ‘in’ to ‘unsure’. Frank’s timidity is a big, and increasing, problem. The football has been difficult to watch, and yesterday’s performance was unacceptable.

He wasn’t my choice to be appointed, but I have posted here, more than once, that he should be given at least two seasons to impart and bed in his vision, and to build a squad that can deliver on it. Now, I am not so sure. He seems to be intimidated by the challenge of managing a big club. There is no sign that he can rise to that challenge.
 
Yiddy said:
When after the first 10 all we showed was relegation form.
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This is factually untrue. First 12 games of last season we were one of the best performing clubs in the league in our underlying numbers (and were placed 6 - not bad but lower than our xP at the time).

It's true our league form fell of a cliff when we endured an unprecedented injury crisis losing 4 of our starting Back 5 for months. But when we got them back and they played together we didn't lose a game (all of those games were in EL).

These are facts. I know it hurts to comprehend them because you sacrificed the true joy other - non-deranged - fans experienced from the EL Trophy but that's the price you pay for derangement. It's a tragedy but one you brought upon yourself.

From now on I suggest being a better person, better supporter and more knowledgeable by following underlying performance metrics and and nuanced understanding of squad dynamics. If you do this you can also be a better friend to Frank by mounting actual arguments that support his case for more time and patience beyond "Fat Fraud was bad mm 'kay".

Once you accept that Postecoglou did as well as he could with a limited squad we can move on to supporting Frank in his efforts to at least match the metrics (and, perhaps, Trophy!) that Postecoglou achieved with that same limited squad. We all want what's best for Spurs after all. We need to demand Frank be backed by players, fans and, most of all - the club.

Right?
 
I voted unsure. I want him to workout, I do.

The pressure is building so the Fulham game is obviously massive and the line up and approach will reveal a lot come Saturday evening.

If he doesn't change the approach now I don't think he ever will.

The handbrake has to come off and thrown out the bloody window at this rate.

We need to see players playing with some freedom and real intent.

It's a pity the PSG game is this week as a clear week to prepare for Fulham with the above in mind would of been ideal.
 
I was pro Frank being appointed because I believed he was a top tactician which saw a small club like Brentford survive in The PL and take some big scalps, but after witnessing a dozen premiership games under him I'm now seeing a timid one dimensional figure who seems so frightened of loosing a game and upsetting senior players to the point where its becoming self-destructive.

For me to continue to support him, he needs to grow a pair and quick!
 
Phomesy said:
It's true our league form fell of a cliff when we endured an unprecedented injury crisis losing 4 of our starting Back 5 for months. But when we got them back and they played together we didn't lose a game (all of those games were in EL).
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Same excuse could be used now only that it is the front players that are missing (with Solanke, Maddison, Kulusevski and Son who we didn't replace).
 
12 games in and we're at the "he needs to adapt" stage of the discourse.

Such a fucking cycle - what a merry-go-round we are :roflmao:
 
Did the math and we have 4 points (one win one draw) from our last 6 games in the epl I believe, dating to mid October.

That's very risky numbers. His December will be big for him.

His numbers prior to that - including especially our GD which is still quite good - are saving him. He needs to get back to that start.
 
caduka said:
Same excuse could be used now only that it is the front players that are missing (with Solanke, Maddison, Kulisevski and Son who we didn't replace).
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For sure - and I've defended Frank's decisions based on exactly that (I am consistent in my views - trust me).

Having said that only Solanke has been a "surprise" injury/absence. We knew Madders, Kulu (until new year) and Son were non factors this season. The window should have answered those problems. If they didn't then - hey, c'est la vie remember last year?

But the wider point is true - our squad lacks true quality and depth. This was true before and remains true now.
 
Nobody3 said:
I was pro Frank being appointed because I believed he was a top tactician which saw a small club like Brentford survive in The PL and take some big scalps, but after witnessing a dozen premiership games under him I'm now seeing a timid one dimensional figure who seems so frightened of loosing a game and upsetting senior players to the point where its becoming self-destructive.

For me to continue to support him, he needs to grow a pair and quick!
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I know. Here's the thing though.

I think he's a much better coach than what he's showing but you've touched on a couple of big points here.

The pressure of the job is affecting him. He's more scared of losing than setting the team up to win and be brave.

He also hasn't handled a group of players like this, a lot of whom are top internationals, world cup winners in Romero etc

I think the players sense he's a bit intimated or overwhelmed by the role, the expectations and pressures.

Players respond more to managers who are strong/tough/respected characters as opposed to softer nice types.

It just seems like it's all affected him too much. Something he's going to have to overcome if he's to last here.

To dare is to do Thomas....roll on Saturday.
 
Tottenham Massive said:
Frank 'in' now below the 50% mark....Already

Obvious Nuno vibes....*in fact, a 'Poor man's Nuno' would be a good description
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I can hear you almost climaxing in anticipation

tired randy marsh GIF by South Park
 
He'll get the whole season, as he should.

Just hope he's learned a lot about himself and the players during this fixture period we're in and willing to make the necessary adjustments to both
 
Phomesy said:
This is factually untrue. First 12 games of last season we were one of the best performing clubs in the league in our underlying numbers (and were placed 6 - not bad but lower than our xP at the time).

It's true our league form fell of a cliff when we endured an unprecedented injury crisis losing 4 of our starting Back 5 for months. But when we got them back and they played together we didn't lose a game (all of those games were in EL).

These are facts. I know it hurts to comprehend them because you sacrificed the true joy other - non-deranged - fans experienced from the EL Trophy but that's the price you pay for derangement. It's a tragedy but one you brought upon yourself.

From now on I suggest being a better person, better supporter and more knowledgeable by following underlying performance metrics and and nuanced understanding of squad dynamics. If you do this you can also be a better friend to Frank by mounting actual arguments that support his case for more time and patience beyond "Fat Fraud was bad mm 'kay".

Once you accept that Postecoglou did as well as he could with a limited squad we can move on to supporting Frank in his efforts to at least match the metrics (and, perhaps, Trophy!) that Postecoglou achieved with that same limited squad. We all want what's best for Spurs after all. We need to demand Frank be backed by players, fans and, most of all - the club.

Right?
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I don't want to make this a whole Frank vs Postecoglou thing as I think they're both very flawed in different ways, but one thing we did show under Ange was that, with an arguably worse squad, we were capable of passing out from the back and cutting through teams. It didn't always work, and by the end we seemed to give up trying, but at our best under Ange we could pass through pretty much any press we came up against.

Under Frank we're better at some of the meat and potatoes stuff like set pieces, but we've completely given up even trying to pass out from the back which makes for pretty depressing viewing. We've attempted the 4th most long passes in the league, more than all of the promoted sides, and have the 6th worst long pass completion %. Given no other teams feature that high on both metrics we may literally be the ugliest team to watch in the entire league atm. Unsurprisingly Brentford would be the closest contender looking at the numbers.

I thought under Frank we'd be getting a bit more of a well-rounded approach following Ange's evangelical style, but at the moment it looks like we've completely swung from one extreme to the other. I just want to watch some reasonably decent football ffs. Think the Copenhagen game is about the only game that's been a fun watch for the full 90.
 
Yiddy said:
I thought we played them off the park that night. Atmosphere was electric and the last true time this club felt as one.
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Yes atmosphere was electric.
Was a fantastic night.
But I went with a Chelsea mate - and I remembered him saying : Woolwich played the better football - especially before the sending off.
The next season we fell apart and they kicked on.

Sometimes there are signs and then the results follow.
Like this season - no one bought it when we were in the top 4. Because we were playing poorly.
 
Timberwolf said:
I don't want to make this a whole Frank vs Postecoglou thing
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It isn't a Frank Vs Postecoglou thing.

It's a "what can we reasonably expect from this squad" thing.

Once we are all on the same page about what we "expect from this squad" then we can make judgements.

I have a very dim view of our squad - so am naturally sympathetic towards Frank because of that.

I just can't abide Derangers being deranged. And will call them out on it. Especially as I don't think it helps our new manager one little bit.

If Frank can make the Villa game metrics our norm he will do very very well. (Yes I know we lost that game but the metrics are EXACTLY what we hoped for with his appointment)
 
justin said:
Those 4 are our best players in our whole squad. The rest are bang average .
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Vic
Porro
Udogie
Bergvall
Are all decent . I am not sure I would put Romero or Kudus in our top 4.

VdV - is our best player - and the one who would get the highest fee.

Our problem is we have some bad players who no one else would want.

Selling the dross is the key.
Getting rid of Richarlison, Johnson Bissouma would give a vibe shift.

Personally I would also sell Spence- he is sub standard - and now is the time to sell - we would get something
 
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