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It seems to be very Tottenham the amount of times in last 20 years we have had player or young player of year is totally disproportionate to trophies we have always loved a hero

City without Aguero, Sanchez at Woolwich, it's just the way it is, the cart leads the horse when someone genuinely steps up and is consistent you have to channel everything though him.
 
By the way, and I can't believe it feels like this even needs to be said, thinking that a manager hasn't excelled in his first season doesn't mean you want him out or aren't prepared to stick with him.
 
I'm not sure what you're trying to get at here...
Are you suggesting we should sack Poch because we haven't improved this season? :llorisunsure:

Im getting at Poch needs to grow as a manager next season stop isolating important players and large numbers of the squad, because his record has not been great this season in terms of performances and targets
 
By the way, and I can't believe it feels like this even needs to be said, thinking that a manager hasn't excelled in his first season doesn't mean you want him out or aren't prepared to stick with him.

The jury is out for me. I want him get his three years at the least though.

For those who are already massively convinced by him, that is way too much to comprehend though.
 
The jury is out for me. I want him get his three years at the least though.

For those who are already massively convinced by him, that is way too much to comprehend though.
The jury is out and that's basically what I expected. 6th and an easy cup run is par at best and that's fine. I certainly see glimpses of reasons to be optimistic, but we shouldn't attribute the potential to succeed later as a positive now. Judge him if he gets backed this summer.
 
If you take out the positives from our two best players, why not keep the "ifs" going to suggest that under performing players have been superb, retarded defenders don't make mistakes, mis-firing strikers score bucketloads, etc?

Because its Poch picking inadequate players when we have better on the bench or not even in the squad. Its Poch exhausting players, and then calling up a CB and playing him at RB after 6 months of not even being in the matchday squad.

Its Poch who has mishandled the squad, then expected them not make retarded mistakes.
We all knew Jan and Fazio was the best CB pairing in December...yet Dier was brought in and we were poorer for it. Now he brings back Fazio, only because Walker is out though.
Its oddball.
Walker went to shit...Dier is the far better RB, but he didnt make that switch through vision, but was forced into it. He even played Vlad at RB over Dier against Villa.

I questioned it 5 minutes before kick off ffs! Then, the next game, Dier at RB. well done. 3pts lost to learn who should have played there in the first place...

Kane and Hugo pick themselves...should I laud poch for picking them?

When Kane needs a rest though, he has no answers. Quite the difference.
 
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It seems to be very Tottenham the amount of times in last 20 years we have had player or young player of year is totally disproportionate to trophies we have always loved a hero

City without Aguero, Sanchez at Woolwich, it's just the way it is, the cart leads the horse when someone genuinely steps up and is consistent you have to channel everything though him.

City without Aguero have Silva, Dzeko, Nasri, Yaya Toure etc etc etc etc.........

Woolwich have a manager with a steadfast philosophy and approach to each game
 
It seems to be very Tottenham the amount of times in last 20 years we have had player or young player of year is totally disproportionate to trophies we have always loved a hero

City without Aguero, Sanchez at Woolwich, it's just the way it is, the cart leads the horse when someone genuinely steps up and is consistent you have to channel everything though him.
No top team has ever had a stand-out performer - you're not allowed to win trophies that way - it's illegal and all records are invalid

:dawsonlol:
 
I agree but if you are referring to mason then I would counter he is not a youngster and personally he is not good enough to warrent a start in every game. I like him and as a squad player have no issues but if we are going to allow players to start as they ' love the shirt' and would spill blood for it then me and you could be in the first 11

We need a balance of players that care, but we need more quality, especially in the middle of the park and up front

I do agree, I just think we allow our expectations to run away at times.

At the end of last season the general narrative was that our problems were down to a lack of passion and pride in playing for the club - too many expensive foreign players with no affinity with the club. We needed to build for the future around a core of youngsters.

That's pretty much exactly what has happened. It hasn't been exciting or spectacular all the way but it was never going to be. We had a cup final and some great results against some top teams and have got some younger players with the potential to be really good for us in the future.
 
Because its Poch picking inadequate players when we have better on the bench or not even in the squad. Its Poch exhausting players, and then calling up a CB and playing him at RB after 6 months of not even being in the matchday squad.

Its Poch who has mishandled the squad, then expected them not make retarded mistakes.
We all knew Jan and Fazio was the best CB pairing in December...yet Dier was brought in and we were poorer for it. Now he brings back Fazio, only because Walker is out though.
Its oddball.
Walker went to shit...Dier is the far better RB, but he didnt make that switch through vision, but was forced into it. He even played Vlad at RB over Dier against Villa.

I questioned it 5 minutes before kick off ffs! Then, the next game, Dier at RB. well done. 3pts lost to learn who should have played there in the first place...

Kane and Hugo pick themselves...should I laud poch for picking them?

When Kane needs a rest though, he has no answers. Quite the difference.

Dier played at CB against Villa because Vertonghen was ill and Walker was injured. Would have been pretty difficult for him to play both RB and CB.

Also, Chiriches being out of the matchday squad for six months is complete nonsense. The only months where he hasn't played two full 90 minute matches are September (international break means less games) and March.

YOU ARE MAKING SHIT UP.
 
Dier played at CB against Villa because Vertonghen was ill and Walker was injured. Would have been pretty difficult for him to play both RB and CB.

Vlad could have played CB......so could Kaboul or Capoue if we wasnt paying them millions of pounds to sit at home

Also, Chiriches being out of the matchday squad for six months is complete nonsense. The only months where he hasn't played two full 90 minute matches are September (international break means less games) and March.

Ok, Im sure we really benefitted from him not playing for months, then used out of position
 
Not going to spend money like Chavs. Best thing we can do is keep investing in young players and also build up our scouting network so we can buy the likes of Hazard and Sanchez before they are well known and with Mitchell and it seems a few more scouts coming here hopefully we can do the bussiness.
 
Vlad could have played CB......so could Kaboul or Capoue if we wasnt paying them millions of pounds to sit at home



Ok, Im sure we really benefitted from him not playing for months, then used out of position

So you now you want to play Capoue and Dier out of position but it isn't okay to do so with Chiriches?

All your current arguments rely on outright lies like the Villa game and Chiriches not playing for months and logical fallacies like arbitrarily deciding which players can play out of position.
 
I said above mate....take Kane out, would they all be lauding Poch as we´d be sitting in 12th.

Massive cracks been papered over by Harry and Hugo time and again, yet its seen as a cracking season with an abundance of youth prospects. Who? Townsend, Mason and Lamela?
Why are we taking kane out? He's a part of our squad. Wasn't even new, he played last season. Made his debut years ago now. Every team gets worse when you take their best players out. Chelsea without Hazard would have dropped a few points. Sanchez, Rooney, Pelle, Aguero... Taking out teams best players or highest scorers is a stupid and pointless argument.

Why didn't you just say "If we had shitter players, we'd have been shitter" Then drop the mic and fuck off.

As for the progress argument, its simple. Who would rather go back to this time last season? When we had a man in charge no one liked, talking shit, insulting players, alienating the squad, playing Kyle Walker right wing, Chadli in defensive mid and who's general tactics made our team weaker as a whole, at the expense of adebayor getting a few more goals.

This season we've had danny rose benefitting from a manager that isn't a cunt, and doesnt leave him exposed on his own against two attackers time and time again. We've had a manager that has picked players on form rather than his agenda/picking them out of a hat (seriously, walker at right wing!) and apart from the united game, we haven't come anywhere close to getting spanked. We have a positive goal difference, albeit a small one.

Last season went tits up. This season united had to spend 60 million on Di Maria, 300'000 a week on falcao. Not only does that show hard it is to improve in the top 5 of the premier league (as if it wasn't fucking obvious enough anyway) but it shows that merely spending money isn't enough. Having a manager we can get behind, who is supported and will be given time, even if we go through a rough patch, could be the answer. And even if it isn't, its definitely 100X better than having that mouthy pe teacher cunt in charge and us all knowing he was getting sacked as soon as the season finished.
 
Why didn't you just say "If we had shitter players, we'd have been shitter" Then drop the mic and fuck off.

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I presently go into very match expecting us to lose. This isnt a nice feeling, but I can't shake it. I'm seeing too many misplaced passes. Too many formations and teams that quite obviously don't work, so we hoy on subs to change it because we can't get it right first time. Too many players being allowed to under-perform for months without censure. If there's a plan there, great. I just can't see it. Just like I can't see overall progress, but I can identify singular positives and they do need to be taken into account in the overall picture.

Similarly though, we see evidence of players benefitting from getting sustained runs in the first team. Would Kane be the same if he'd been in and out? Lamela was one of our better players yesterday, yet a few weeks ago people were knee jerking. Sometimes we do have to make the sacrifice of letting someone play shit for a few games so we benefit in the long run.
Actually i kind of disagree with that part. If anything, the players who play shit tend to get dropped for weeks on end. Paulinho started the season dogshit and disappeared. Chiriches cost us goals and now only plays out of absolute necessity. Soldado got given plenty of chances. etc.
 
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