1882 Section??

[sammyspurs]

Um no, who said that?

You can try this game all you want, but I'm ain't playing. It's damned clear what I am talking about....well, unless you are genuinely obtuse.

I say Graham, you say Hitler
Graham
Hitler
Graham
Hitler
Let's call the whole thing off

tum tee tum

 

[57 varieties]

Irving Scholar used to have an electronic board on the wall of his office at WHL that counted each person going through the turnstiles.

Every club has that - I've witnessed it first hand in PL boardrooms on matchdays

ken bates is very well known for it!

 

[Flav]

Not sure how healthy this thread is a day before the actual event.

 

[Éperons]

Of course. Why, are you somehow offended by my "when you attend a match" comment? This has, after all, been about how support it given at games.

At the end of the day only those fans who cannot attend matches know whether or not support is in their hearts, but that isn't going to have any impact on the support given in the stadium itself.

Not offended at all. Just curious, since I don't quite understand what you've got in mind. I suppose you're making a distinction between "fan" and "supporter" that I don't entirely grok (Flav, I think, has made a similar distinction on the pod before, and that I didn't understand, either).

(It was interesting listening to the Spurs Show this week, as Dan Louw copped to being a boo-boy as well as one of those whose patience is running thin vis-à-vis AVB. But he also said that he's ashamed of these reactions since he knows how completely irrational they are. This is in contrast with the other guest, Willie Morgan, who basically said he wanted Harry back.)

 

[sammyspurs]

as said earlier they will be filmed for future reference by thfcs football intellengence unit i gaurantee you.
do you remember what happened with the sol song at portsmouth!!.. that wasnt a few individuals i was there but a few individuals copped life bans

As wrong as they were, they tried to make the Sol song about race, and he himself had claimed it to be racist iirc. The song wasnt racist, but it was fucking vile, and sick, and Im glad it's not sung. They were also done for homophobic chants.

The song Im talking about is nowhere near that level.

 

[Sibs]

The key to all this is the fact that historically we are not fans, we are supporters. "Support" is the operative word. It should not matter how much it costs, who you are sitting with, who the manager or players are or anything else. When you attend a match you do so on the premise of getting behind whoever represents your club's badge at the time. To me there is no more to it than that. If you cannot do that then you are not a supporter and certainly not a fan.

I cant agree with that. I support the club, and not everyone is fit be at the club.

Are you saying the fans that wanted Graham out were not real supporters? Or if we signed Marlon King, we would not be real supporters if we we didnt want him at the club and refused to back him?

Integrity also plays a part, and if Ribery and Benzema get done for banging child prostitutes, and we signed them, I wouldnt be backing them, just because they put on a Spurs shirt.

Thats extreme, but its the logical conclusion to your argument for me.

Well, obviously extremes like that are an exception. I'm quite clearly talking about the relative normality of players and manager trying to win games. Otherwise, you'd have to say that I would be happy going to a Spurs match if Hitler were the manager and the side were full of high ranking Nazis, which I think is pretty idiotic and is clearly not what I am referring to.

Honestly didn't think we would reach Godwin's law for another few pages

 

[57 varieties]

Not sure how healthy this thread is a day before the actual event.

please dont get me wrong, i'm all for 1882 getting behind the young uns & creating a wall of noise..to me its all part of football at the lane & always has been. i wish them well & glad to see many other people recognise that the passion of football is having its heart pulled out by a new wave of so called support.

 

[57 varieties]

as said earlier they will be filmed for future reference by thfcs football intellengence unit i gaurantee you.
do you remember what happened with the sol song at portsmouth!!.. that wasnt a few individuals i was there but a few individuals copped life bans

As wrong as they were, they tried to make the Sol song about race, and he himself had claimed it to be racist iirc. The song wasnt racist, but it was fucking vile, and sick, and Im glad it's not sung. They were also done for homophobic chants.

The song Im talking about is nowhere near that level.

those 4 that didnt accept the punishment & took the case to court won fella!.. the judge threw the case for prosecution out without it ever entering court... 4 others have appealed thier sentence as well since then.

calling others a "cunt" in a song is still abusive & anti social & makes you no different to them in the eyes of the law.

 

[MoodyCOYS]

I'm going cause it'll be fun. I like singing and cheering my team. Haven't had that at the Lane for ages. That simple, for me!

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Of course. Why, are you somehow offended by my "when you attend a match" comment? This has, after all, been about how support it given at games.

At the end of the day only those fans who cannot attend matches know whether or not support is in their hearts, but that isn't going to have any impact on the support given in the stadium itself.

Not offended at all. Just curious, since I don't quite understand what you've got in mind. I suppose you're making a distinction between "fan" and "supporter" that I don't entirely grok (Flav, I think, has made a similar distinction on the pod before, and that I didn't understand, either).

(It was interesting listening to the Spurs Show this week, as Dan Louw copped to being a boo-boy as well as one of those whose patience is running thin vis-à-vis AVB. But he also said that he's ashamed of these reactions since he knows how completely irrational they are. This is in contrast with the other guest, Willie Morgan, who basically said he wanted Harry back.)

There is a distinction, but they are not mutually exclusive. The meaning is in the word I think. You can be a fan of the club, but you can also be a boo boy. You are a fan of the style of football, the colour of the shirt, the cockerel, some of the players and so on but you are so intent on getting your money's worth that cheering on the team is not the most important thing to you. That's when a fan can be a fan but not a supporter. A supporter to me is when a fan decides that there is something that they must do to help their team win. So they do the only thing that is really open to them. They sing as loud as possible to try and lift the players. They is offering your club support, hence they are "supporters".

That's the way I see it anyhow.

Not getting to a lot of games doesn't mean someone isn't a supporter in their heart. For me, it's enough to say that if they could get to a game then they know they would be a supporter and not just a fan.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Honestly didn't think we would reach Godwin's law for another few pages

Do you know how many months I've had to wait to make a Hitler post?

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Not sure how healthy this thread is a day before the actual event.

I'm hoping it serves as a reminder for people to sing their hearts out.

 

[Éperons]

There is a distinction, but they are not mutually exclusive. The meaning is in the word I think. You can be a fan of the club, but you can also be a boo boy. You are a fan of the style of football, the colour of the shirt, the cockerel, some of the players and so on but you are so intent on getting your money's worth that cheering on the team is not the most important thing to you. That's when a fan can be a fan but not a supporter. A supporter to me is when a fan decides that there is something that they must do to help their team win. So they do the only thing that is really open to them. They sing as loud as possible to try and lift the players. They is offering your club support, hence they are "supporters".

Got it. Seeing as "fan" comes from "fanatic", I've always considered it a rather strong term, so I didn't understand the implicit tiering (despite your saying they're not mutually exclusive) between the two. In France, they distinguish between a "supporter" and a "touriste", with the claim that PSG had gotten rid of its supporters and replaced them with touristes.

So in that sense, being a supporter is one of many means by which one performs their being a fan, which means that it's—as a performed identity—necessarily contingent. I can be a supporter one minute, not the next, and again the third. But fan is perhaps a bit more deep, a bit more constant. I'm a Spurs fan even when there's no match on. It's tough to imagine how one could be a supporter when there's no match on, however, unless the idea of trying to rally other fans, making banners, etc., in preparation of the next match counts, which I suppose it should.

I guess, then, in response to sammyspurs, those booing Graham, at that time, were not supporters, but it doesn't mean that they weren't supporters at other times. The only bump is that I don't think it's black/white regarding what is and isn't support.

Now the question becomes: can one be a supporter without being a fan? The aggrieved "soccer mom" who cheers her children on while not actually caring at all about the sport, about who wins, about the team, etc.?

 

[sammyspurs]

those 4 that didnt accept the punishment & took the case to court won fella!.. the judge threw the case for prosecution out without it ever entering court... 4 others have appealed thier sentence as well since then.

And that goes to show that the club are powerless to do anything about the song Im talking about. Those guys won, and the song was a million times worse!

 

[Burko]

I guess, then, in response to sammyspurs, those booing Graham, at that time, were not supporters, but it doesn't mean that they weren't supporters at other times. The only bump is that I don't think it's black/white regarding what is and isn't support.

There were a lot of fans singing "man in the raincoats blue and white army"

They weren't happy with Graham, but supported Spurs regardless, it can be done, you just need to go about it the right way.

 

[Blanchflower]

This thread = tl;dr

 

[Tucker]

Um no, who said that?

You can try this game all you want, but I'm ain't playing. It's damned clear what I am talking about....well, unless you are genuinely obtuse.

I say Graham, you say Hitler
Graham
Hitler
Graham
Hitler
Let's call the whole thing off

tum tee tum

To be fair I think if you drew a little tache on Graham he would look a little bit like Hitler

 

[sammyspurs]

[

I guess, then, in response to sammyspurs, those booing Graham, at that time, were not supporters, but it doesn't mean that they weren't supporters at other times. The only bump is that I don't think it's black/white regarding what is and isn't support.

The post that made me bring up Graham stated:

" It should not matter how much it costs, who you are sitting with, who the manager or players are or anything else. When you attend a match you do so on the premise of getting behind whoever represents your club's badge at the time. To me there is no more to it than that.If you cannot do that then you are not a supporter and certainly not a fan."


My post has zero to do with booing. The above quote suggests that those who were not behind Graham, were not supporters and "certainly not" fans. Thousands of people didnt back him, it doesnt mean they booed him either.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

I still sang and cheered when Graham was in charge FWIW.

 

[sammyspurs]

I still sang and cheered when Graham was in charge FWIW.

Which we all did, but you said that being a supporter meant "getting behind whoever represents your club's badge at the time. To me there is no more to it than that.If you cannot do that then you are not a supporter and certainly not a fan."

You may have backed the club, but if you didnt back Graham personally, in your own words, you wasnt a supporter. Your words mate.