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Management Ange Postecoglou

Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports

Eight wins out of 10, do you deserve more credit?

You get what you deserve so I probably deserve whatever I am getting. I think it is fair enough depending on your outlook. Whether it is deserved or not, I try to make the point that criticism and scrutiny is healthy because it allows you to reflect on your beliefs and your convictions. Because if you are going to flinch at the first time people are critical or want you to change your path then it probably means you are not definite about what you are doing.

It's not something I think 'ah we are copping too much criticism' or unwanted criticism. In fact, if it is unwanted even more that we shouldn't react to it. It is up to us how we behave in that environment because I don't think that ever changes. Even if we went on another fantastic run, at the first sign of us maybe faltering the same sort of questions would come because it is kind of where we are at as a club at the moment.

Until we have success then I think that is always going to be the first thing people come at us about as a club and you have got to accept that. It is part of our journey and part of us becoming stronger. And like I said, having real conviction in what we do.

I have said it to the players, if you want to grow a beautiful garden you have to handle some fertilizer. That is the only way it will happen.
 
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sudoku said:
Eight wins out of 10, do you deserve more credit?

You get what you deserve so I probably deserve whatever I am getting. I think it is fair enough depending on your outlook. Whether it is deserved or not, I try to make the point that criticism and scrutiny is healthy because it allows you to reflect on your beliefs and your convictions. Because if you are going to flinch at the first time people are critical or want you to change your path then it probably means you are not definite about what you are doing.

It's not something I think 'ah we are copping too much criticism' or unwanted criticism. In fact, if it is unwanted even more that we shouldn't react to it. It is up to us how we behave in that environment because I don't think that ever changes. Even if we went on another fantastic run, at the first sign of us maybe faltering the same sort of questions would come because it is kind of where we are at as a club at the moment.

Until we have success then I think that is always going to be the first thing people come at us about as a club and you have got to accept that. It is part of our journey and part of us becoming stronger. And like I said, having real conviction in what we do.

I have said it to the players, if you want to grow a beautiful garden you have to handle some fertilizer. That is the only way it will happen.

Plenty of shit in this thread from the ice dancing fans and those who are living in a time warp.
Last season is over, you wombats.
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Lin Manuel Miranda Love GIF by Tony Awards
 
BlackLips said:
Eh that’s a very specific timeline and specific stat to be negative about. Starting exactly when we had a rough run of fixtures last year and bad form. This season we are 8th. Underlying stats show we are probably better. 3rd in goal difference. Defensively better. Some lapses cost us points for sure.

Also, losses are overrated in comparison to draws. We just rarely draw and seem to have been that way for a few years. We’ve been either fewest or second fewest draws each year over the past 4 seasons. It’s why we seem so helter skelter but also why we were still in it for top 4 in Contes last year (until he got fired and we collapsed). This is in comparison to some Poch years where the draws really held us back. Win and loss is one more point than 2 draws but the panic after the former is much worse.
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Gooners at Sky start the narrative by cherry picking stats, then get their gooner troll mates on TFC to stir the pot.

Put them all on ignore mate.
 
meaningless-friendly said:
Every game feels like a lottery with us, because we always seem to give up several good chances to score against us. If the opposition can take them, they win.

I don't know the stats and whether we are better or worse than other teams in this regard, it just feels this way from a fan's perspective.

There's no control, it's a rollercoaster. It's a Jimmy White v a Steve Davis. Jimmy took fans on the rollercoaster and was the people's champion. He won 0 world titles. 'Interesting' Steve Davis won 6. Spurs are Jimmy.
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That's such a lazy narrative, come on.

Only Liverpool this season have conceded less clear cut chances than Spurs in the league and they've conceded 5 goals all season.
 
BlackLips said:
Eh that’s a very specific timeline and specific stat to be negative about. Starting exactly when we had a rough run of fixtures last year and bad form. This season we are 8th. Underlying stats show we are probably better. 3rd in goal difference. Defensively better. Some lapses cost us points for sure.

Also, losses are overrated in comparison to draws. We just rarely draw and seem to have been that way for a few years. We’ve been either fewest or second fewest draws each year over the past 4 seasons. It’s why we seem so helter skelter but also why we were still in it for top 4 in Contes last year (until he got fired and we collapsed). This is in comparison to some Poch years where the draws really held us back. Win and loss is one more point than 2 draws but the panic after the former is much worse.
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It'd be easier if these people simply just admit they don't like Ange on a personal level.

Pretending they have some kind of insight to his managerial quality or cherry picking stats to make a point just makes them a bit of a joke.
 
SpursUpNorth said:
You think? Our history with them doesn't back that.. Last decade the managers averaged on less than a year.

I really hope you're right though, as we need to give someone to implement their players and style over time. The most succesful clubs are able to do that
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I think as long as Ange shows signs of progress and consistently qualifies for Europe, he'll be safe in the job. A trophy or two wouldn't go amiss either but they won't save him if our league form turns to shit (14th or lower).

A mid-table finish this season and success in the cups would be tolerated by the board and would earn him some street cred with fans who long for the excitement of cup football but he would have to improve league form next season. A mid-table finish without any cup success and he's on very thin ice.
 
Kid Chameleon said:
I think as long as Ange shows signs of progress and consistently qualifies for Europe, he'll be safe in the job. A trophy or two wouldn't go amiss either but they won't save him if our league form turns to shit (14th or lower).

A mid-table finish this season and success in the cups would be tolerated by the board and would earn him some street cred with fans who long for the excitement of cup football but he would have to improve league form next season. A mid-table finish without any cup success and he's on very thin ice.
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As United showed with Ten Hag, cup success means little without being competitive in the leage. And I'll tell you why i think that. The problem with this approach is the jeapordy in cup comps. You are one bad performance away from exiting the cup with nothing to show for it. And as we know under Ange, we are very liable to put in a bad performance.

Yes United have higher "expectations" but ultimately, Ange has to have us fighting for the top 4 minimum. If he wins a cup it might grant him a reprieve, but as I mentioned, the jeapordy is massive.

If Ange has us in midtable and then for example, we lose the cup semi final or final, what do we have to show for it? Fk all. What happens to Ange then? he's probably fired. Relying on cup comps is not a sustainable. So yeah if Ange doesn't have us competitive in the league, a cup win might save him, but realistically we probably won't win a cup, so he'll be gone.
 
Starks said:
It'd be easier if these people simply just admit they don't like Ange on a personal level.

Pretending they have some kind of insight to his managerial quality or cherry picking stats to make a point just makes them a bit of a joke.
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Nope. Nothing against him personally, although I be honest I don't find him particularly likeable with his arrogant approach nor standing there gormless on the touchline, but that's more to do with the results under him.

You know it's possible that some fans are simply unhappy with his management, 9 defeats in 16 PL games and us looking like a midtable side under him.
 
The games we have lost, capitulated in have been due to our physical/mental collapse resulting in on field mistakes. Brighton the best example of all. We were ruthless in the first 45 and we got our reward, but instead of coming out in the second half with the instruction of...2 banks of 4, 10 yards deeper and don't concede for the first 20-25 minutes and now look to pick your moments when to press and break don't force it. Instead I suspect Ange encouraged the team to continue from where they left off in the first half, Ange-Ball! I waffle on about this a lot, its because I'm convinced if AP can be humble enough to admit to himself that Ange-Ball in The EPL dosen't produce the same results as The J-League and The SPL, then we have a manager who has the right mentality to create someting special at The Lane.
 
Silvio Dante said:
Because there was only defeat in the 6 games before that?
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To be fair even with that its not a whole lot better

That would be
Played 22, W9, D2, L10.
Equates to 50 pts over a season. 10 defeats from 22 league games is still pretty desperate.

I get why people dont want to include last season and if we had become harder to beat and were around 4th or 5th the form in the last third of last season would be irrelevant. But its when it becomes a pattern and systemic that's the issue.

As Tottenham fans we've seen before when poor form from one season bleeds into the next with Hoddle, Ramos and Poch so at the moment i'd say its absolutely relevant looking at the last 16/22/30 or whatever games, especially as we basically have the same team bar Solanke. Check out Levys sacking statements, he cites the previous seasons results from mid season for all 3.

I have a dread if the worst comes to the worst we'll end up with Graham Potter who i really dont rate so i really dont want to see him binned, but he has to improve the league form.
 
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This “cherry picking” of runs always happens. It’s natural to do so. If we are playing well and getting good results, we go back to the first good result and form opinion from that. Same is true for a bad run. No issue with it whatsoever.

However, I do think straddling two seasons to get this “bad run” isn’t helpful, especially considering the fixtures we had at the end of last season and the fact we have added new players to the squad since then.
 
Aphex said:
How is 9 defeats in the LAST 16 games cherry picking? Do explain
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Why 16? Why not 20 or 5?
Who really gives a fk, just win the next one right?
Aphex, it’s probably different for me, I only got to see TH in the nineties up close, then most of my life in Aus or Asia. And regardless of internet, it’s fkn hard to see much more than highlights. Nineties London I remember was all about digging in and pumping up for the next battle. I fkn loved that and I still think it’s what makes the difference - managers and players will come and go, supporters are the soul and essence of the club - fuck the last 16 or 20 or 5, let’s fkn smash that fkr Cash and his brummy mates and then go do some damage in the cups
 
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