Coronavirus Crisis

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Should we continue to have crowds at football stadiums?

  • Yes

    Votes: 17 18.3%
  • No

    Votes: 76 81.7%

  • Total voters
    93
They're not all the same. It's both dangerous and lazy thinking to make such a claim.
They're all within a margin of error of what we would describe as "the centre" (which is obviously entirely relative to the place and time) compared to the full spectrum of extant political thought.
 
America finally got shocked into action in the course of 24-48 hours, and we are probably 2 weeks behind Europe.

How the FA and UEFA haven't acted yet is criminal. How the fuck were their spectators at Leipzig and Anfield? Why is football still being played in Europe?

Cancel the season.
Move the Euros to 2021.
Government needs to step up and support small business and workers.

STOP. FUCKING. AROUND.

The horrid answer is money, cancelling almost a quarter of the season would cost the FA and Uefa millions and would drive a massive amount of clubs into possible administration.
 
America finally got shocked into action in the course of 24-48 hours, and we are probably 2 weeks behind Europe.

How the FA and UEFA haven't acted yet is criminal. How the fuck were their spectators at Leipzig and Anfield? Why is football still being played in Europe?

Cancel the season.
Move the Euros to 2021.
Government needs to step up and support small business and workers.

STOP. FUCKING. AROUND.
That shit with the NBA put it into perspective. We had a player test positive who has likely given it to a teammate, who was in an arena with 20,000 people. The last game that was played by the infected player had a referee who was in an arena on the other side of the country that had 20,000 people in it. At the very least everything has top be played behind closed doors.
 
The horrid answer is money, cancelling almost a quarter of the season would cost the FA and Eefa millions and would drive a massive amount of clubs into possible administration.
I'm well aware of the reason. A lot of things happened all at once in the US and it just turned into a tidal wave.

The entire NBA is suspended.
The NCAA mens basketball tournament, arguably the biggest sporting event in the US outside of the Super Bowl, will be played behind closed doors and likely cancelled.
Large gathering have been banned in several large cities and states.
Soon, the NHL and the MLS will be suspended as well.

Every institution and governing body that makes these hard decisions makes it easier for others to do the same. The UK government leadership has been poor. The FA leadership has been poor. UEFA has been fucking criminal. No one is willing to step up and say enough is enough.
 
I'm well aware of the reason. A lot of things happened all at once in the US and it just turned into a tidal wave.

The entire NBA is suspended.
The NCAA mens basketball tournament, arguably the biggest sporting event in the US outside of the Super Bowl, will be played behind closed doors and likely cancelled.
Large gathering have been banned in several large cities and states.
Soon, the NHL and the MLS will be suspended as well.

Every institution and governing body that makes these hard decisions makes it easier for others to do the same. The UK government leadership has been poor. The FA leadership has been poor. UEFA has been fucking criminal. No one is willing to step up and say enough is enough.

100% agree, we haven't seemed to have learnt from other countries that this virus spreads incredibly fast, when you act its too late. They seem to be using a protocol for a virus that isn't like this one.
 
100% agree, we haven't seemed to have learnt from other countries that this virus spreads incredibly fast, when you act its too late. They seem to be using a protocol for a virus that isn't like this one.
Tea and a stiff upper lip is not a plan for a pandemic. But that seems to be what Boris thinks at the moment. Also, I get you are a fucking island, which probably helped delay it a few days, but it's not fucking 1500 anymore. It's not like the Coronavirus is waiting for France to build ships and invade.

PS: I am not directing this anger to anyone here, I'm just incredulous reading some of the comments from leaders. Clearly the US is in no position to throw stones in that regard, but fortunately we have state and local leaders filling in the gaps right now.
 
I feel he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.

What do you think he should do?
Lock the country down now - stop 90% of flights, cancel all events outdoors over 200 people and indoors over 50, close all schools put everyone who can on home working and introduce a 'social gap' so keep a metre away from everyone else ... go balls out stop pissing about this is now very real ask any doctor from Italy.
 
I feel he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.

What do you think he should do?
At this point there's nothing he can do other than cancel large gatherings. Hindsight is 20/20 but leaders should have cancelled travel when this shit started. We would have all killed them for overreacting, but it would have been the right move.
 
No idea what makes him think we will get it as bad as that when other counties while worrying the percentage is still tiny. hes saying neatly a million people in NI will get it, there is no such evidence anywhere... yet.
Agreed. That number, if it's even vaguely official, will be the worst case scenario from biocomputational predictive modelling with the input of the government's advisers on statistics, virology, epidemiology etc. for the purpose of policy and logistics planning. As part of a democratic government's putative duty of transparency (insofar as any of those things exist), their numbers will have been published in a freely available policy document that any journalist could then find and sensationalise.

The emphasis is, of course, on "worst case" and "predictive model", and that's if the number comes from a reputable source in the first place. Our official worst case projection is actually 80% of the population becoming infected, which is why I didn't dismiss the 50% out of hand. The figures make great headlines but the probability distributions of these things are usually such that the absolute worst case scenario is predicted to occur vastly under 1% of the time.

The models have gotta be pretty rough though. As you rightly say, our epidemiological knowledge of COVID-19 is not good. Acquiring good epidemiological data on novel diseases is an intractable problem and the only results we can use right now are predictions and inferences from other coronavirae and the info we have from China. Unfortunately, the Chinese government is unreliable and have form for the assertion: it's widely agreed that they significantly downplayed SARS-1 at the time, which only became apparent long after the epidemic was already over.
 
At this point there's nothing he can do other than cancel large gatherings. Hindsight is 20/20 but leaders should have cancelled travel when this shit started. We would have all killed them for overreacting, but it would have been the right move.
The media have been bloviating on this very subject. According to them, travel bans don't "work". Obviously, they do work - if nobody had left China, neither would SARS-2 - but the criticism is coming from a pseudo-ethical perspective rather than a sound scientific one.

The point they're trying to hammer home seems to be something about xenophobia and how it's more important to be politically correct than to prevent and/or survive a pandemic. I'm glad they're sticking to their principles and not being hypocritical about all of this: it is indeed better to die than to hurt someone's feelings.

Anyway, if Trump of all people proposed a travel ban, the media would be metaphorically crucifying him (I mean, more than they do already). It would be like a perfect storm to them. Meanwhile, China, a homogeneous totalitarian nation, is just embarrassing Western democracies with its efficiency. Imagine trying to create a new hospital within a week in Britain, let alone two.
 
The media have been bloviating on this very subject. According to them, travel bans don't "work". Obviously, they do work - if nobody had left China, neither would SARS-2 - but the criticism is coming from a pseudo-ethical perspective rather than a sound scientific one.

The point they're trying to hammer home seems to be something about xenophobia and how it's more important to be politically correct than to prevent and/or survive a pandemic. I'm glad they're sticking to their principles and not being hypocritical about all of this: it is indeed better to die than to hurt someone's feelings.

Anyway, if Trump of all people proposed a travel ban, the media would be metaphorically crucifying him (I mean, more than they do already). It would be like a perfect storm to them. Meanwhile, China, a homogeneous totalitarian nation, is just embarrassing Western democracies with its efficiency. Imagine trying to create a new hospital within a week in Britain, let alone two.

They wouldn't even have scheduled the first meeting within a week.
 
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