Harry Kane

[Beech]

So essentially you are agreeing with KaneDomBadBoy here, as the only way that will happen is for him to move to another club.

You both may not agree on the value of Kane and on how good he is, but you almost agree on the end goal.

Well yeah. Kane wanted to go and we should have allowed him to go instead of pricing him out of the move. I've never said anything different to that. If we're keeping him then we need to add genuine quality to the team regardless, because him and Son can only take us so far.

Regardless of what "stats" NDomBadBoy likes to pluck from his arse hole all the time, as long as he's actually fit, opponents would much rather play us without Kane in our side than with. Do some idiots genuinely think they would worry more about Moura or Bergwijn?

 

[KaneDomBadBoy]

So you're insisting that one of the best players in the world has more cons than pros.

Madness. At least the weird Son supporters here that don't actually support Tottenham will like your post.

As I clearly stated, he's one of the best strikers in the game when he has the ball AT HIS FEET when he's in and around the box and can also pass a bit. But he's not without flaws and those flaws unfortunately hinder us in many ways given the way our squad is constructed.

Now if Kane played for Man City, the world class players around him are going to help gloss over his flaws as a player. But unfortunately for us and Kane, City and all the 'bigger clubs' don't seem to really rate him highly versus other alternatives on the market.

 

[Shotgunofmichalebrow]

Still stupid in here huh.....

 

[Nuts]

and can also pass a bit

That's a bit like saying a Russian Armata tank can blow holes in walls a bit.

 

[Spaniel]

What is xG?​

Very simply, xG (or expected goals) is the probability that a shot will result in a goal based on the characteristics of that shot and the events leading up to it. Some of these characteristics/variables include:

• Location of shooter: How far was it from the goal and at what angle on the pitch?
• Body part: Was it a header or off the shooter's foot?
• Type of pass: Was it from a through ball, cross, set piece, etc?
• Type of attack: Was it from an established possession? Was it off a rebound? Did the defense have time to get in position? Did it follow a dribble?

Every shot is compared to thousands of shots with similar characteristics to determine the probability that this shot will result in a goal. That probability is the expected goal total. An xG of 0 is a certain miss, while an xG of 1 is a certain goal. An xG of .5 would indicate that if identical shots were attempted 10 times, 5 would be expected to result in a goal.

There are a number of xG models that use similar techniques and variables, which attempt to reach the same conclusion. The model that FBref uses is provided by StatsBomb. What sets StatsBomb's xG model apart from others is their use of freeze frames. A freeze frame is the location of all players on the pitch at the moment the shot was taken. Was the goalkeeper in position? Was it an open goal or were there a number of defenders between the shooter and the goal? Was the shooter being pressured? Was it a 1v1 situation with the keeper?

What a bunch of crap.

 

[Rooster]

That's a bit like saying a Russian Armata tank can blow holes in walls a bit.

That is a bad analogy but I know what you mean lol

 

[Rooster]

That's the truth unfortunately. I think other teams see it as well hence the reason why Kane's true market value is only 75 million + add ons vs 150+ million many fanboys think he's worth.

Since the 18-19 season w/o Kane Starting but w/ Son playing >60 mins

Premier League
12 Wins
2 Draws
5 Losses
*19 matches, 38 points

Champions League
Dortmund (1 leg) - Advance
Man City (x2 legs) - Advance
Ajax (x2 legs) - Advance

Europa League
Lask (1 leg) - Win

FA Cup
Middlesbrough - Advance
Southampton - Advance

It is always someone else's fault when Kane doesn't perform. 3 Cup finals, a complete no show. If he was an NBA player he would have been killed by the media here in the US. No disrespect to Kane, I think he is an elite player but If you can't perform when it counts you are NOT world class. Scoring many against subpar teams are just basically stat padding like Russell Westbrook. Show me what you can do when it matters is the most important talent in a world class player. I don't believe Kane has that. Son on the other hand does score in big games against more difficult oppositions and the club does seem to function better when he is on the field.

 

[Bazali]

This season will be a nightmare for him

You’re correct

He doesn’t want to be with us playing in front of a midfield of Winks Skipp and Hojberg getting virtually no service

 

[prinmemo]

It is always someone else's fault when Kane doesn't perform. 3 Cup finals, a complete no show. If he was an NBA player he would have been killed by the media here in the US. No disrespect to Kane, I think he is an elite player but If you can't perform when it counts you are NOT world class. Scoring many against subpar teams are just basically stat padding like Russell Westbrook. Show me what you can do when it matters is the most important talent in a world class player. I don't believe Kane has that. Son on the other hand does score in big games against more difficult oppositions and the club does seem to function more well when he is on the field.

The US analogy doesn’t make sense here. The “hero” standard in the US is very annoying to me since it is BS, but in the context of basketball, for example, it makes sense since there are only five players on the court for each team, so a single super star player can carry his team to a championship. To a lesser extent, something similar could be said for QBs in American football.

This sport requires more team work, so a super star player needs support, particularly when playing the 9 where the player needs to rely on his teammates to pass him the ball in situations that he could use to score goals. That being said, I believe Kane has underperformed in big games.

 

[Murphy]

That's the truth unfortunately. I think other teams see it as well hence the reason why Kane's true market value is only 75 million + add ons vs 150+ million many fanboys think he's worth.

Since the 18-19 season w/o Kane Starting but w/ Son playing >60 mins

Premier League
12 Wins
2 Draws
5 Losses
*19 matches, 38 points

Champions League
Dortmund (1 leg) - Advance
Man City (x2 legs) - Advance
Ajax (x2 legs) - Advance

Europa League
Lask (1 leg) - Win

FA Cup
Middlesbrough - Advance
Southampton - Advance

I think I've seen that before

 

[Rooster]

The US analogy doesn’t make sense here. The “hero” standard in the US is very annoying to me since it is BS, but in the context of basketball, for example, it makes sense since there are only five players on the court for each team, so a single super star player can carry his team to a championship. To a lesser extent, something similar could be said for QBs in American football.

This sport requires more team work, so a super star player needs support, particularly when playing the 9 where the player needs to rely on his teammates to pass him the ball in situations that he could use to score goals. That being said, I believe Kane has underperformed in big games.

Not saying Kane had to win it for us by himself. I'm just saying he should atleast be performing at a high level in the important games which he hasn't. He basically went missing in all those 3 cup games.

Example:
For QB, Tom Brady can do more with less (Won 7 superbowls)
Lebron can do more with less (Won 4 titles)

Lebron actually lost more in the finals than he won but he is still considered the best because he consistently performs in those games. IF Kane is the best striker in the world... he has to do better.

For me, he hasn't improved since he turned 25. It feels like this is his peak.....
Don't get me wrong he is still great but not the best.

 

[StripiestPilot]

Kane right now looks like a player who chose to go on an extended holiday instead of train during preseason. He is weeks behind the others in terms of his fitness work and it shows on the pitch.

But get even a rusty Kane on the ball in dangerous areas and he will do the business, like he did against Pacos the other week. Like he did for England during the break. Kane’s individual lack of sharpness is not the only reason why he was invisible against Palace.

 

[Rooster]

Kane right now looks like a player who chose to go on an extended holiday instead of train during preseason. He is weeks behind the others in terms of his fitness work and it shows on the pitch.

But get even a rusty Kane on the ball in dangerous areas and he will do the business, like he did against Pacos the other week. Like he did for England during the break. Kane’s individual lack of sharpness is not the only reason why he was invisible against Palace.

You should score against Pacos regardless. They are a very weak side.

But I do agree he did miss weeks of training due to his transfer situation.. but that is on him. Not the club.

 

[sudoku]

 

[KaneDomBadBoy]

It is always someone else's fault when Kane doesn't perform. 3 Cup finals, a complete no show. If he was an NBA player he would have been killed by the media here in the US. No disrespect to Kane, I think he is an elite player but If you can't perform when it counts you are NOT world class. Scoring many against subpar teams are just basically stat padding like Russell Westbrook. Show me what you can do when it matters is the most important talent in a world class player. I don't believe Kane has that. Son on the other hand does score in big games against more difficult oppositions and the club does seem to function more well when he is on the field.

That's a good way to put it - Kane is a stat padder and bullies inferior teams largely because we, as a team, bully the opposition. Kane is the generally the beneficiary of us being able to dominate the opposition.

But when the going gets tough, he's not the player that's going to grab the game by the scruff of the neck and win it for us. That would be Son in most circumstances.

 

[Dudski]

When a team is 15th in the league in possession at just 43% it is hard to draw conclusions about a team's usual scorers. People have commented on Kane's body language. He was watching the same game we were. Maybe he was as bored as the rest of us. Who knew Spurs had Serie A DNA?

 

[todd1882]

Bet he scores in the next game he plays.

How about the game after that though? Wanna bet on that one?

 

[sudoku]

 

[todd1882]

Said it before many times but will say it again even if the fanboys don't want to hear it. As the squad currently stands, we are better off without Kane and using the proceeds to invest in other areas of the squad. His value is only going to continually diminish. For those that have blinders on, I've broken down his game into simple and objective pros/cons for you to understand:

Pros
-One of the best in the world with the ball at his feet in and around the box - not many do it better
-Good passer of the ball for a striker that can operate as an above average #10/false 9 for short periods of time if needed
-Good in the air when he's unmarked - rarely misses open headers
-Decent at holding the ball up and link up play
-When he's fit and plays for the team, his defensive work is second to none for a striker

Cons
-Lacks pace and mobility which in many ways, prevents him from getting service. We often hear complaints from the fanboys saying he doesn't get service. A big part of getting good service requires the attacking player to quickly move into dangerous/open areas. Kane's lack of pace and mobility makes is relatively easy for PL defenders to mark him when he does not have the ball at his feet in and around the box
-Slow/lethargic in counter attacking situations - again, lack of pace is a big issue
-While he's a good passer of the ball, he's probably not mobile/physical enough nor has enough endurance to be converted into a full time #10 and/or #8
-His off the ball movement is often poor. If you watch truly world class strikers they are constantly moving around with quickness and cleverness
-He doesn't have the physicality/strength like he used to - just watch his performances from 4-5 years ago vs now. He regularly gets physically bulled by bigger/stronger Premier League defenders
-Below average dribbler of the ball - has a hard time beating defenders on the dribble even in 1v1 situations. Has virtually no tricks/moves to take on defenders and creating something from nothing.

With all this said, having 1 or 2 prime Eriksen type of of creative midfielders would mitigate any of the issues Kane has in his game as they'll be able to put the ball in Kane's feet, in and around the box. However, at this point in time, we do not have those type of players so Kane's issues as a player is becoming very apparent. To make matters worse, it doesn't ever look like Levy will do what is necessary to bring those caliber players into the team nor would those players want to join a squad playing in the ECL.

Fantastic post.

 

[Luvf]

I'm talking about now. The present. Not years ago. Kane wouldn't have wanted to leave in the first place if we still had that sort of quality.

He's a world-class player with too many average players around him, Son excluded. He deserves better than the team we have now after all the goals he's scored for our club.

You are here today because of the past.

The teams Kanes had in the past 6 seasona had everything, soldiers lutenants and backers and coaches and managers even Morinho. It just was waiting for that one last piece -The leader. It could have been a great team that won several titles. All Kane needed to do was become the true leader and make history and become immotal in Spurs dynasty. But in that Kane needed to be a bit less selfish and put the focus onto the team efficiency, unity and victories rather than his golden boot runs season after season.

Kane chose to swear a goal away from Erickson. Kane chose to keep shooting at defenders bodies instead of passing to wide open team mates year after year. Kane chose to dream about playing with KDB after all the years of him not being able to deliver when it counted.

You want to talk about today? I just described how we arrived today in a nut shell.