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Competition Is It Match Fixing?

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Are Referee's Reffing Us Out of The Premier League?

  • Total voters
    151
1882 said:

View: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DYfnkjXuAaa/?igsh=MWRqOW02cmNvbGtnbA==
At least everyone sees it for what it is...
No tin foil hats needed any more.... Just the common sense of right and wrong!
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It's boiling up now.
If it was more than just our fans making this much noise it would be getting much more attention.

I did hear a snippet on Talksport yesterday where they were asking Spurs fans to call in if they thought something was going on. I was too busy to listen. And knowing them, they'd have their usual actors phone in and make us look stupid.
 
Matt1882 said:
But no, it's definitely not match fixing.
Definitely not fixed that the team about to win the league have avoided 3 nailed on red cards.
That 1 of the 2 teams fighting relegation has had dreadful, head scratching decisions against them all season, while the other one has handballed it in their box THREE times and got away with it
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I think what you're describing with teams getting different treatment from the referees isn't match fixing, rather it's league fixing, with officials conspiring throughout the season for certain teams to win the league and others to get relegated.

Wouldn't it just take one referee to be offered something to comply with the conspiracy, turn the offer down, and blow the whistle on the whole thing? (no pun intended).
 
1882 said:
Sky want their "AGUEROOOOO!!" moment back, and aren't afraid to stoop to any levels to get it!
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what if the Aguero Moment is "Haaaaalanad, at the death to win the 3 points versus Bournemouth" and then Palace get a pen and Woolwich get a red card in the final game of the season, and end up winning while Pep wins the treble in his last ever season as City boss....... :rdzarms: :mickyarm::ange-arms::contefists:
 
I think to understand what constitutes match fixing - and how possible it is to do by the refs and VAR panels, it's worth looking at the data before VAR was introduced.

So the Independent Key Match Incidents Panel reported 82% of major decisions judged correctly pre-VAR - that is up to about 93% since VAR has been deployed.

And I do think, pretty obviously, offsides will be a big reason for that increase as offsides are almost entirely not subjective - youre either on, or off, to a painfully minute level currently.

So where the biggest room for perceived error is always going to be for penalties and fouls, these are subjective incidents, and there is a huge burden on the VAR to show a clear and obvious error from the on-pitch decision.

For me, VAR has made it HARDER to match fix - fouls and anything that requires an interpretation of the law is still decided by humans - and is still subjective - nothing has changed other than it can be reviewed in real time -

So if you believe matches are being fixed, it is not only being done in plain sight, but it is being done in plain sight with more scrutiny than ever being allowed by fans and the players/managers.

Which for me means they are in on it, which basically makes this wrestling.....
 
Matt1882 Matt1882 - yep I have multiple times said Troussard when it was obviously Havertz. Sigh!

Anyway, point remains. Commentators stretching to say “maybe not sufficient force” to justify no red is silly. He lunged in, from behind, studs high, and caught him squarely in the calf.
 
I watched the last half hour of the match last night and couldn't believe my eyes at that Havertz 'tackle'. Just ask yourself if a spurs player did that in any game would they would be sent off - I think we all know the answer. Fucking farcical.
They time wasted and play acted out the last 25 mins of the match at home to Burnley. Disgusting that team is going to be champions. utter cunts
 
harry7 said:
Most of these conspiracy theories fall apart when you consider the number of people that would need to be involved and, the potential ramifications.

IF PGMOL are working to influence the outcome of match to favor specific teams:

There are 19 Officials, and 29 assistant officials. + VAR officials. How many of them are in the know? How can you believe none of them will become a whistle blower? What's in it for them? Payments/gifts would be easy to trace. Can they all keep their mouths shut to friends and family?

If it were uncovered, ramifications would be huge. Prison sentences and collapse of major clubs. Again - how to the PGMOL ref's benefit from this???

Big conspiracy - Nope, I don't buy it.

Refs natural bias towards particular teams/players - likely.
Refs under pressure to not make bad decisions against the biggest teams - very likely.
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Bravely said.!
 
harry7 said:
Most of these conspiracy theories fall apart when you consider the number of people that would need to be involved and, the potential ramifications.

IF PGMOL are working to influence the outcome of match to favor specific teams:

There are 19 Officials, and 29 assistant officials. + VAR officials. How many of them are in the know? How can you believe none of them will become a whistle blower? What's in it for them? Payments/gifts would be easy to trace. Can they all keep their mouths shut to friends and family?

If it were uncovered, ramifications would be huge. Prison sentences and collapse of major clubs. Again - how to the PGMOL ref's benefit from this???

Big conspiracy - Nope, I don't buy it.

Refs natural bias towards particular teams/players - likely.
Refs under pressure to not make bad decisions against the biggest teams - very likely.
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I was actually considering joining the match fixing train had they given the weak ass penalty for Saka last night.

Influencing games works better when giving things - penalties, red cards etc...... not giving a pen or card has less influence on an outcome IMHO

if they really, really wanted to FIX the result last night, they would have given that pen.
 
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dudu said:
I was actually ready to jump on the match fixing thing had they given a pen in the first half for the Saka incident. Lets be honest, match fixing is much more effective when you take an action rather than an inaction.


I was actually considering joining the match fixing train had they given the weak ass penalty for Saka last night.

Influencing games works better when giving things - penalties, red cards etc...... not giving a pen or card has less influence on an outcome IMHO

if they really, really wanted to FIX the result last night, they would have given that pen.
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Wasn't that quite early on, though? No need to fix it that early. At home, to worst team in league.

What I think might help, is an example of what is and isn't acceptable, shown to the VAR room and the fans at the same time, so they can watch PRECEDENT and CURRENT simultaneously.

Literally, show a 'Given', 'Current' and 'Not Given' side-by-side, for comparison in real-time. So they can see a peer-reviewed example of 'Given' to steer towards consistency. Remind them what we're all going to be seeing in a few minutes on social media.

Now I've cooled off, I can say with some certainty that while it might not be match-fixing, it is clearly broken. Either unconscious bias towards 'keeping up the excitement of a final day finish' (monetarily motivated), deliberate prejudice/favoritism, or simply (and most likely) ineptitude and a lack of specificity in the rules that makes it harder for these weak-minded fools to make a decision.
 
harry7 said:
Most of these conspiracy theories fall apart when you consider the number of people that would need to be involved and, the potential ramifications.

IF PGMOL are working to influence the outcome of match to favor specific teams:

There are 19 Officials, and 29 assistant officials. + VAR officials. How many of them are in the know? How can you believe none of them will become a whistle blower? What's in it for them? Payments/gifts would be easy to trace. Can they all keep their mouths shut to friends and family?

If it were uncovered, ramifications would be huge. Prison sentences and collapse of major clubs. Again - how to the PGMOL ref's benefit from this???

Big conspiracy - Nope, I don't buy it.

Refs natural bias towards particular teams/players - likely.
Refs under pressure to not make bad decisions against the biggest teams - very likely.
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It's all possible with compartmentalization- keep folks on a limited scope of communications, a "need to know basis", and use subtle threat of force or violence to enforce silence. Just look at the Epstein files, for example...
 
dudu said:
Chelsea actually gets penalised ever so slightly more than we do in terms of fouls per attempted tackle and cards per attempted tackle - and our cards per foul are separated by 0.01
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It's not always the number of fouls but at what point in the match they occur. My perception is that we are very likely to pick up early yellow cards as compared to our opposition. I've noticed in a number of matches our ref will penalize us early on, and then even up the card count later on in the match when it's less damaging to the opposition.
 
dudu said:
I think to understand what constitutes match fixing - and how possible it is to do by the refs and VAR panels, it's worth looking at the data before VAR was introduced.

So the Independent Key Match Incidents Panel reported 82% of major decisions judged correctly pre-VAR - that is up to about 93% since VAR has been deployed.

And I do think, pretty obviously, offsides will be a big reason for that increase as offsides are almost entirely not subjective - youre either on, or off, to a painfully minute level currently.

So where the biggest room for perceived error is always going to be for penalties and fouls, these are subjective incidents, and there is a huge burden on the VAR to show a clear and obvious error from the on-pitch decision.

For me, VAR has made it HARDER to match fix - fouls and anything that requires an interpretation of the law is still decided by humans - and is still subjective - nothing has changed other than it can be reviewed in real time -

So if you believe matches are being fixed, it is not only being done in plain sight, but it is being done in plain sight with more scrutiny than ever being allowed by fans and the players/managers.

Which for me means they are in on it, which basically makes this wrestling.....
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but they clearly don't care about the scrutiny? do they seem ashamed or scared of losing their jobs over the blatant bad decisions and non decisions?
 
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