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Manager Jose Mourinho

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Don Corleone said:
well yeh mate because this club are forever the bridesmaids but never the brides. If we are going to get to any more finals, then we need to go about bloody winning the thing. How many more times do we keep saying “ well we was unlucky , next time “ , it’s about time this club achieved proper success. Proper success and accomplishment is winning the final, not losing it.
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It’s what he doesn’t get because he supports the old manager more than he does the club.
What the prick refuses to understand is that if Jose fails then he fails.

I for one won’t be calling failure an achievement because I want to suckle on the managers ball bag.
It’s failure whoever the fuck is in charge.

Here he is claiming he’ll call a lost final an achievement under Jose and its harsh to call it failure while at the same time mocking him for not winning a cup.
What cup was we in? FA and CL, the best shot we went out to 4th division but I’ve never seen him mention it.
If Jose after five years has failed as much as Poch, I’ll be calling for his head.

I guess Scott and his like will be saying we’ve been successful though right?

Poch massively achieved but the club failed?
Says it all who they support and it’s not the current set up.
 
scott said:
The worst thing for me was when we were 2-0 up at chelsea & decided to be nasty cunts which cost us the game yet people were loving it. Probably the nastiest I saw us & it actually turned in to a disaster.
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So Pochs tactics then and not the transfer window cost the game which was ultimately the very last chance to stay in the title race.
Pochs tactics handed Leicester the title.

Finally admits it even though it was supposed to be a clever dig at the notion we need to be more nasty. Slipping.
 
Pump0293 said:
I have watched the final celebration's again and I feel that Jose's reaction is not completely true. He is making a big deal so we think he has done a fantastic job. When in truth we should have done better. If he would have not been so pig headed about playing Troy and giving him a chance when Harry was injured then I truly believe we would have gotten a few more points.Playing people out of position when we had a perfectly good striker at the club who without giving him a chance how do we know how ready he was. Any other manager would have used youth players but not Jose. Or he could have brought one in January or loaned one. Instead he signed another winger to and to the 3 -4 we already had and also a cm to add to the many we have already. Could have used the 20 plus mill and brought a decent backup or gone to RM and got jovic on loan
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Something poch was criticised for as well. Not playing young players enough. Jose is doing the same thing.
 
Airfixx said:
Numbers were crunched at the time and defensively speaking it would be negligible.

But a couple of notes:

- Ben played a large chunk of 16/17 (as well as 17/18) so should be significantly creditable with both of said seasons; not just 17/18.
- As freakish as it sounds, Dav & Jan were suggested to have had a better record in their spell together.
- 16/17 was at WHL whilst 17/18 we had to acclimatise to Wembley....
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Dav is a unpredictable player. He can be 9/10 or 4/10, he has brilliant power and speed and is brave but isn’t great on the ball. The issue we have is that Verts was another level on the ball compared to the rest of our defenders even Toby. This means he provided great balance, a stopper with a ball player. With Dier and Dav we have two stoppers but in modern football you need a ball player to prevent the defence being pressed easily when in possession.

I rate Dav, Dier, Tanganga as stoppers but I don’t think we have any real replacement for peak Verts, that is more the issue. Fix that and more importantly get a quality DM and we have potentially a very good defence. It’s not that our players are shit, it’s more the squad lacks balance and that is the issue with everything we do in my opinion.
 
GDG said:
The problem is your scenario has no sense of reality. It really isn’t possible for a team to lose 10 European Cup / Champions League finals but win no domestic trophies. The quality of a team that can progress so far in the premier competition in Europe will lend itself to one capable of winning domestic trophies.

There’s a Latin term for the way you argue, it’s called reductio ad absurdum - it means you take a point and expand it to its illogical conclusion to disprove it. Using this form of debating would be like me saying - as you think Jose will do better at Spurs than Poch because he’s won trophies, would you therefore rather have Alex McLeish too? As he’s won a trophy? You wouldn’t of course, but it doesn’t disprove your point about Jose (I’m not a Poch lover BTW before you jump on that).

It’s just a stupid way of making a point, try to construct better arguments instead.

No Spurs fan would rather have zero trophies and 20 CL final defeats, but that doesn’t equate to last years scenario that I, as a fan, felt incredibly satisfied getting to a CL final, more so than I would have winning a cup I consider a borderline friendly competition.

Question for you, would you rather England win the Nations Cup, or get to a World Cup final?
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Sammy making terrible arguments... never! I gave up after this.... Spending big is a waste of time & gets you nowhere. The only reason city & chelsea win titles is because they bought them. Its a hollow victory.
 
Clynelish said:
The sooner the toxic elements within the fan base get over Poch the better.
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I am. People were debating poch & jose. So I pointed out that the ones who criticised poch for not playing enough youth players said mourinho would. Be he isn't either. Others especially mourinho lovers have brought up poch far more than me.
Look up poch on my posts & before last night I have barely even mentioned him. It is relevant to this thread & posters were debating him & jose..
The one's constantly bringing up poch to criticise him don't seem over him & are pretty toxic if you ask me. They are ready to turn on jose with their targets. Things like if jose got us to a CL final it would mean nothing. Where as I think that would be a good accomplishment on jose's part. Yet they would actually think what a lot of shit losing in the final. Bloody loser! Then rant about weak mentality & no one remembers the runners up as they are losers.
 
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Tomo said:
Dav is a unpredictable player. He can be 9/10 or 4/10, he has brilliant power and speed and is brave but isn’t great on the ball. The issue we have is that Verts was another level on the ball compared to the rest of our defenders even Toby. This means he provided great balance, a stopper with a ball player. With Dier and Dav we have two stoppers but in modern football you need a ball player to prevent the defence being pressed easily when in possession.

I rate Dav, Dier, Tanganga as stoppers but I don’t think we have any real replacement for peak Verts, that is more the issue. Fix that and more importantly get a quality DM and we have potentially a very good defence. It’s not that our players are shit, it’s more the squad lacks balance and that is the issue with everything we do in my opinion.
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Fair nuff... The point at hand wasn't to argue who is or has been the better player or to say the Dav of today is everything we need him to be; just that dropping him despite being the in-form CB (also see Davies) has harmed us in the longer term.
 
I was watching a documentary on Barcelona the other night and he featured heavily. A lot of the golden generation were saying that us he used to take training for the youth and was totally committed to the Cruyf philosophy. Years later, after he left Chelsea but before Madrid, Barcelona were sniffing and had practically offered him the job but internally, people said a) Pep was a ready made coach and b) Mourinho had adopted a more physical approach o the game.

I'm neutral, I hate getting beat first and foremost. I honestly don't care how well we play if we get beat.
I hate cheating. If our players are consistently doing it, I'm losing interest and respect.
I hate scruffy football. When you have teams like Stoke and West Brom who score the odd set piece and spend the whole match punting balls up the pitch, that's horrific.

But I'm ok with letting good defenders defend and use that to play proper football from back to front. Some of the counter attacking goals we've been scoring recently aren't a fluke. They're clearly by design and we've needed that in our game. Teams sat deep and we couldn't break them down no matter how many attackers we had on the pitch.
By dropping back, giving the ball away, we get chances.
 
ChrissyWaddleShares said:
Can’t believe I’m getting involved in this...

could we not say that ‘getting to the CL final’ is the achievement and should be celebrated? Losing, no - but the relative achievement of being one of 2clubs in European leagues able to do so, at that point in time? Likewise, winning the LC in 2008 was also an achievement. Had they occurred in the same season and with the same players, then the comparison is relevant - otherwise, they are different achievements(or failures, depending on your views) and should not be compared?
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Great post. To think that great night away to Ajax is already being used as a stick to beat us with & somehow turned in to a negative. & its crazy to me that if jose gets us to a CL final, some will see this as a failure & a negative. Jose would have done very well to get us to a CL final.
 
GDG said:
Nah I’m good thanks. I’ll continue to cherish the memories that stoke my emotions, like you do with a league cup that’s just a reserve competition until the semis.

I find it amazing that you are criticising me for celebrating losing the final of the CL, but lauding Jose, who literally this weekend threw a celebration for getting 6th. We all make our own judgment on what quantifies success.

Hypocritical much? Are you calling him a loser for that?
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Keep up with rules. CL final is shit. 6th is a massive achievement.
 
FightingIllini said:
We'd be more fulfilled than Utd were though.

My god, the thought of this core squad going their entire Spurs career without lifting a trophy keeps me up at night. If it's on a Wednesday night in an empty stadium in Gdansk, so be it.

One way or another Mou isn't here for long, he never is. Let's just get what there is to get while he's here.

I understand people saying he's not in keeping with the character of the club, but he'll be gone in two years regardless, don't worry about it.
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I am suprised how many think its a given he will win us silverware especially if he only has another season or 2. & if we predictably don't get his targets . Wish they would have a bet with me on it :eriksenserious:
 
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spursmalc said:
On the subject of whether losing a final in a more important competition is better than winning a lesser competition, is not easy . However if you look at the F A Cup we have been to 9 finals. I have been to the last 4 and I can tell you the Coventry one we lost does not register as a good day. The disappointment that day was tremendous. The League Cup is nowhere near as important as the F A cup and this coming season will be even less important as it is expected that the early rounds will be scheduled the same weeks as European Competition meaning playing Tuesday and Thursday. I equate the Europa with the UEFA cup which we have won.
I think if you have won the competition then losing finals are not important but if you have never won the competition like CL then losing the final is the best you have achieved and important until you actually win it. Therefore whilst last season's CL final is important to us I doubt Liverpool think much of the previous year when they lost in the final.
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True. Its like comparing real madrid losing a CL final to us losing one. They are on another level to us.
 
Baggio1988 said:
I'm surprised how easily you are completely writing off a man who has won trophies for fun based on half a season with crazy circumstances
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You won't even bet on him winning stuff with me so I think you are all talk & are just waiting to turn him on. Fast forward 2 seasons & Jose gets us to a CL final. Then you bang on about what a failure that is & how it means nothing. & he has a loser mentality now.
 
Jose's post-Porto career can be summed up in a few words:

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black echo said:
Which one to win the League?
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Huh? You think he will win us the league? If not, why bring talk of winning titles in to it. Most important thing is points obviously. But if u play like us you will go out to teams like norwich in cups & drop pts to teams like Sheffield united in the league . So I think we would have to improve our performances to get enough pts to challenge for the title, let alone win it. We can't perform the way we have & win the title I'm afraid. But maybe you are right & we will.
 
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