Although I voted against the red, I can see how Foy might have made that decision in the spur of the moment. Still, I don't believe Naughton deliberately blocked the ball with his arms and that it would have been a clear goal (unlike a goal line clearance).
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Guy raises his arms to protect his face instinctively... Ball hits arms, arms flail around due to ball hitting them.
Even Nolan's left arm goes flailing all over the place in a so-called "unnatural" position after he smashed the shot, if it had rebounded off the post and hit his arm would it have been seen as deliberate?
If Naughton blocked that on purpose he should give up football and apply for Neo's job in the Matrix.
Even Nolan's left arm goes flailing all over the place in a so-called "unnatural" position after he smashed the shot, if it had rebounded off the post and hit his arm would it have been seen as deliberate?
If Naughton blocked that on purpose he should give up football and apply for Neo's job in the Matrix.
In hindsight and with lots of replays.Pen,yes, Red No
But i can see why the original decision was made
But i can see why the original decision was made
'Twas a pen but a harsh red card.. Saying that it would not get rescinded if we appeal..
Let's just take it on the chin and laug even more at the Spam as they couldn't beat us with 10 men and missed a pen..
Let's just take it on the chin and laug even more at the Spam as they couldn't beat us with 10 men and missed a pen..
If Foy didn't see it, which apparently he didn't, it's wrong for him to give a red on the lino's say so. Look at the farce of Rose v City. Anyway, delighted we beat that lot, the team I like to see us beat the most. So sweet in injury time too. I've watched the game three times now, plus MOTD 
given the distance between Nolan and Naughton, and given that Nolan got some meat on the ball, I doubt that Loris could have predicted where to put his hands to make a save, had he been the same distance when it was struck.
Factor in that Naughton wasn't looking at Nolan as he struck the ball, then only a fool would assume that he intentionally placed his hands there to make a block.
The only mistake he made was to not put them behind his back, but having turned he could well still have handled the ball. Naughton has no way out, and no way of predicting the flight of the ball - he threw himself in between goal and the striker of the ball, and was desperately unlucky to have been struck on the arm.
Yep in the letter of the law..........yada yada yada
You'd have thought that two (so called) professional match referees would be able to work that kind of shit out. Trouble is, they are not applying common sense, they are pandering to the refs committee guy who's watching and marking their performance, and trying to second guess the analysis paralysis fuckwits, who are employed by TV companies to mountains out of molehills.
The sending off was just further proof that Foy is a sub standard referee. Like he needs to keep on showing the world his limitations........
Factor in that Naughton wasn't looking at Nolan as he struck the ball, then only a fool would assume that he intentionally placed his hands there to make a block.
The only mistake he made was to not put them behind his back, but having turned he could well still have handled the ball. Naughton has no way out, and no way of predicting the flight of the ball - he threw himself in between goal and the striker of the ball, and was desperately unlucky to have been struck on the arm.
Yep in the letter of the law..........yada yada yada
You'd have thought that two (so called) professional match referees would be able to work that kind of shit out. Trouble is, they are not applying common sense, they are pandering to the refs committee guy who's watching and marking their performance, and trying to second guess the analysis paralysis fuckwits, who are employed by TV companies to mountains out of molehills.
The sending off was just further proof that Foy is a sub standard referee. Like he needs to keep on showing the world his limitations........
No not at all, but I was curious as to whether you had a genuine solution to a clear issue.
You want clarity. I said interpretations will always be a part of the game.
You are right, but what's the solution!?
Weird that its only deemed deliberate if the ball is on target.....had that been an innocuous cross, you might not even get the pen.
My take - penalty, but no red:
1) Naughton's arms raise well before Lloris's (even thought it's slowed down), so the guy would have to be like a fucking cat on speed to even be able to react to stopping that with his arms intentionally.
If it is intentional, he'd be a world class shot stopper!
2) The FA Rule that this was only a yellow - the angle makes it look like it's less "on target", but you never know how the ball will swerve without inference anyway, so if the gooner cunts get only a yellow for this:
Then #NeverARed
1) Naughton's arms raise well before Lloris's (even thought it's slowed down), so the guy would have to be like a fucking cat on speed to even be able to react to stopping that with his arms intentionally.
If it is intentional, he'd be a world class shot stopper!
2) The FA Rule that this was only a yellow - the angle makes it look like it's less "on target", but you never know how the ball will swerve without inference anyway, so if the gooner cunts get only a yellow for this:
Then #NeverARed
Gibbs was a lucky bastard there...My take - penalty, but no red:
1) Naughton's arms raise well before Lloris's (even thought it's slowed down), so the guy would have to be like a fucking cat on speed to even be able to react to stopping that with his arms intentionally.
If it is intentional, he'd be a world class shot stopper!
2) The FA Rule that this was only a yellow - the angle makes it look like it's less "on target", but you never know how the ball will swerve without inference anyway, so if the gooner cunts get only a yellow for this:
Then #NeverARed
Gibbs wasn't - he got sent off.
Oxlaide Chamberlain was lucky, he only got a yellow from the FA after it was 'fixed'
The solution is allowing refs the flexibility to come to a consensus on the rules and how they are applied, rather than the set-in-stone approach of FIFA. It's all well and good a bunch of old men in suits coming up with if's and buts in a board room because they feel they need to cover all possibilities due to being paid so much, but there are so many modifiers and caveats to any given decision that the rules are nigh on impossible to apply correctly in a real-time situation...or the rule isn't thought through properly and you get instances where a team is hugely penalised (red card and penalty) because a guy accidentally handled the ball but it happened to contravene the 'clear goal scoring opportunity' rule.
A handball can be deliberate anywhere on the pitch of course. I think people were alluding to the ball being on target as a means to give Naughton a red card
I meant that he was sent off because it was on target, which seems to automatically assume it was deliberate. It clearly wasnt deliberate, and had it been on the edge of the 18yard box, with the ball going away from the goal, even a penalty might not have been given.....
Point being that the exact same incident doesnt suddenly become intentional due to where it happened, and what direction the ball was travelling.
Yes and I do this too when going out to block crosses shots but when I've lost sight of the ball for a few seconds in the box I'm getting desperate and I can certainly understand any training deserting a player at that point.
I'll challenge you to try and make a large stride as he does at the end of a run without doing very something very similar with your arms.
The instinct also would be to get them away from the waist, which is an area more likely to result in contact with the ball
I see this debate is still rumbling along. I think it shows the lack of clarity in the rules & the difficult split second decisions refs have to make sometimes. Don't get me wrong, Foy is a bell end, like a lot of other refs, but it really can be a tough call to make knowing you are going to have it scrutinised, analysed & dissected for days afterwards. On another note, has anyone heard if we are appealing the red card? Looking at Chamberlains world class save earlier in the thread, surely there's a case for it to be rescinded.
I don't think there is a lack of clarity in the rule book personally. It was a definite pen, and probably a red. I think Naughton kinda panicked and didn't intentionally try and block the shot but it didn't matter. What I think should happen though, is that referee's should be allowed to use common sense and not deem situations like that a red as it is bloody harsh.
That being said, I posted some really out of order tweets at the incident in anger.
That being said, I posted some really out of order tweets at the incident in anger.
Unless its naughton where I'm fine with it.