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Stadium SPURS-FANS-STAND-BAN!!!

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alexwooty said:
I'm all for those who want to sit being allowed to sit, and those who want to stand being allowed to stand (or at least not being actively hassled for standing). There are plenty of both types of fan, and also plenty who will just go with the flow either way. For all these types of fan to be happy though, there'd need to be:
  1. A clear demarcation between those areas of the ground where sitting is enforced and those areas where a blind eye is turned to standing. Similarly to how everyone knew that you shouldn't expect to be able to sit in the PL Lower or to stand in the West Lower at old WHL.
  2. The right number of blocks allocated to the two "zones" of the ground so that those who strongly want to sit or stand can get into the right area to suit them, and as few fans as possible find themselves in the wrong type of block. In other words the right balance of supply and demand between the two zones
Number 1 could be achieved IMO if the club can come up with some very carefully-worded statements/warnings for fans when they buy their tickets. Maybe something like "please note that the seat you have selected is in a block where persistent standing during the game is strictly prohibited. Failure to comply with this may result in ejection from the stadium" for the sitting zones, and "please note that the seat you have selected is in a block where fans have been known to frequently stand during the game. If you would strongly prefer to avoid this, we recommend that you select a seat in a different part of the stadium where you can be guaranteed an unimpeded view of the pitch while seated" for the standing zones. Get fans to tick a box saying they've read these warnings at the point of sale, and then there are much less grounds for complaint from both types of fan. Obviously to keep the authorities happy they wouldn't be able to actually say that standing is permitted anywhere, but I'm sure they could find a way to word the warnings so that fans can read between the lines while still being able to comply with safety regulations.

Number 2 could be a bit trickier. The fact is, the % of the crowd that wants to stand isn't fixed for every game - it depends on kick-off time, Saturday vs Sunday, opposition, etc. What's clear is that the 7000 seats in the South Lower with the safe standing future-proofing aren't enough to cover the demand for standing. The right number is somewhere between 7000 and 20000. The easy option would be to make the whole South a sitting-not-enforced zone all the time, but there'd still be matches where less than 17000 fans want to stand. And there'd still be fans who'd want to be able to enjoy the atmosphere of the South while being able to sit down...

Of course the other thing the club can do to help their case with the authorities is clamp down on away fans standing. But actually that's a bit of a slippery slope, as it'd surely lead to other clubs doing the same when our away fans come to visit, and that could cause all sorts of problems with our away support!
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Imo #2 is a lot more achievable than #1.... For 1 to happen the club be seen openly a bucking regulations. Not happening.

Standing in the old gaff was no more officially approved.

As already noted the stand/sit debate is a non starter.

A section for the 'rabble' is the best we can hope for until the gov. have a change of heart.
 
This issue could be put to bed in one action if premier league grounds were allowed safe standing.

It's crazy that you can watch a match from the leagues below, some with big crowds, and be able to stand. Can't recall any incidents post Hillsborough?

Dortmund fans can't stand for European games but can for league matches? Again without incident!
 
alexwooty said:
And that's the reason that I think the ban on alcohol in view of the pitch is a blessing in disguise. If beer at seats was allowed, there'd be a never-ending stream of people going back and forth to the bars throughout matches.
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Tipping point has been reached already IMO.

New stadium doesnt suddenly mean were all prone to hunger during the 90.... Again, just points to a seating arrangement fail.

Maybe this irritant will fade as the novelty wears off. Can't see the atmos resolve itself without a seating re-jig tho.
 
B-0-Sspurs said:
This issue could be put to bed in one action if premier league grounds were allowed safe standing.

It's crazy that you can watch a match from the leagues below, some with big crowds, and be able to stand. Can't recall any incidents post Hillsborough?

Dortmund fans can't stand for European games but can for league matches? Again without incident!
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You'd still be plagued by the non-singing burger squad.....

Sort this shit out in the meantime cos safe-standing isn't 'just around the corner'.... Regardless of a few handrails being pre-emptively installed.
 
B-0-Sspurs said:
This issue could be put to bed in one action if premier league grounds were allowed safe standing.

It's crazy that you can watch a match from the leagues below, some with big crowds, and be able to stand. Can't recall any incidents post Hillsborough?

Dortmund fans can't stand for European games but can for league matches? Again without incident!
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If the arse fell out of the premier league and the TV money dried up and the net result was half empty grounds. Quess what? You would be amazed at how quick the authorities would be calling for so called safe standing.
In the mean time you can only stand up when they tell you it's ok.
 
Neumanator said:
I went to watch Bath Rugby a couple of years ago and couldn't believe the lack of interest in the actual match, most 'spectators' more interested in filling their faces with a burger and beer and chatting with companions or on the phone, the whole experience ruined by people constantly walking back and forth in front of me, completely blocking my view of the action. This is the consequence of modern life, where 'clients' expect corporate provision of environment, entertainment and refreshment, be that at home or at an event. Enjoy the bright, shiny bauble that is the NWHL, but expect nothing more than you would from a visit to the O2 or similar establishment.
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I went to Harlequins recently. Atrocious atmosphere. Doesn't help when no one, even the rugby 'experts', have no clue what the referee is doing some of the time. There were about 50 food and drink outlets catering for anything you would ever want. All people seemed to be doing was eating and drinking in vast quantities. I mean there is nothing wrong with that but these people were having about 10 pints in 2 hours (and getting up during while doing it). Still behaved themselves mind but just didn't care about the match.
On the flip side, from a supposedly old school club, I went to Orient in the FA Trophy. They have shit support I tell you and incredibly heavy handed stewards assaulting the away fans from Telford.
 
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B-0-Sspurs said:
This issue could be put to bed in one action if premier league grounds were allowed safe standing.

It's crazy that you can watch a match from the leagues below, some with big crowds, and be able to stand. Can't recall any incidents post Hillsborough?

Dortmund fans can't stand for European games but can for league matches? Again without incident!
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I thought I'd heard that if the govt give the go ahead for safe standing it will still only be for a certain percentage of capacity; so I can see it still being an issue in the big games.
Coming to the game on Saturday I heard a bloke on the train talking about the gradient of the upper Park Lane and how dangerous it could be for people standing; just wondered if anyone up there has had probs?
 
Gotnohair62 said:
I thought I'd heard that if the govt give the go ahead for safe standing it will still only be for a certain percentage of capacity; so I can see it still being an issue in the big games.
Coming to the game on Saturday I heard a bloke on the train talking about the gradient of the upper Park Lane and how dangerous it could be for people standing; just wondered if anyone up there has had probs?
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We have built a stand with the maximum gradient allowed and put in an area lower down that encourages standing. This was always going to be an issue due to the current ground regulations the Premiership clubs have to abide by.

The best move would be to make the Paxton lower safe standing as well and make the lowest part of the South West just above the safe standing more of a family area.

This would improve the atmosphere at the Away end and make sure that at least part of the south stand is always visibly seated for the authorities.

Won’t happen...... but in a perfect world........
 
I am surprised no one has looked at this from the clubs point of view. The club have only recently got their licence and no doubt this is still under review and closer scrutiny than more established grounds. Standing is not allowed but ignored in many places. The club need to be careful for a while to ensure the Authorities remain happy and if that upsets some supporters that is the price they must pay. I really cannot see that the club really cares if supporters stand although has to take notice of sitting supporters. I think things will settle down and hopefully both types of supporters will be happy by mid season next year.
 
No problems standing in our part of the south stand and I’m not surrounded by casuals

If you’ve got a seat in any other part of the ground you’ve made your choice really. Don’t see what more the club can do under current regulations
 
Steed_Train said:
No problems standing in our part of the south stand and I’m not surrounded by casuals

If you’ve got a seat in any other part of the ground you’ve made your choice really. Don’t see what more the club can do under current regulations
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Good for you, but that doesn't speak for the entire south stand experience

#Jack'sAlright.
 
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The sooner safe standing is introduced - particularly for stadia as modern as ours the better.
I fucking hate standing personally, but I know its important to some people, and in a well sculpted stadium like ours, it should be possible to implement

Practically, it is much safer and cheaper to police, to have people standing in safe standing areas, than it is to have large amounts of people standing in areas full of seats - surely the authorities and legislative bodies can see that?
 
Mick Cooper said:
The sooner safe standing is introduced - particularly for stadia as modern as ours the better.
I fucking hate standing personally, but I know its important to some people, and in a well sculpted stadium like ours, it should be possible to implement

Practically, it is much safer and cheaper to police, to have people standing in safe standing areas, than it is to have large amounts of people standing in areas full of seats - surely the authorities and legislative bodies can see that?
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Until the authorities can make more money out it, i don't think it will be changing as soon as people think.
 
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