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Transfers Summer 2021 - Transfer Thread

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TheSpurEst said:
I can see that people are suggesting and fantasizing of wholesale of changes...
Well... there is a lot to be moved on, but we cannot remove all the old guard at once either, even if they are not up to task.

I think if we manage to terminate loans of Vinicius+Bale and permanently move on Sanchez, Doherty, Sissoko and Moura/Lamela that would already be huge in terms of departures. Sure Winks will never be what most here hoped he would be. But I am still okay having him as 6th option in CM behind Hjojberg, Ndombele, Skipp, Lo Celso and Sarbitzer (or someone else of his class). Pretty much same goes for Dier and Davies as well - doubt they are gonna be starters if we want to progress, but they are homegrown utility options.
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permanently move on Sanchez, Doherty, Sissoko and Moura/Lamela that would already be huge

Absolutely agree, however all on good wages, which I fear other clubs will not want to pay so without subsidising the remaining years of their contracts. its going to be difficult to move them on.

I think we will be lucky to move on half of them this summer, sadly .
 
Tomo said:
No it’s not complete but we had a big window, probably the best I can remember at the club, we needed a DM, CB, RB, LB, AM, ST and we got all of them excepting the CB was inexperienced and Jose wanted Skriniar. To top this off Ndombele finally settled and sorted most of his fitness out so that’s 7 players alone compared to prior. This is the backing Poch was wanting but Jose got.

We pay Jose 15m a year because he is supposed to be better than Poch, A man who can make the team a sum of its parts. Yet we play crap football and get average results. We are being blown out of the water right now by Moyes and West Ham who have a far shitter squad.

I can accept we have one obvious weakness our CB’s but there is no excuse for the attacking football when you have what we have. Ok we have some average players in reserves we need to sell, so does it everyone else bar maybe City or Liverpool. The whole thing is excuses, excuses, excuses. Levy for once properly backed a manager, it’s on Jose to deliver.
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The only thing we got that could count towards a rebuild was a DM (PEH), LB (Reguilon) and RW (Bergwijn). The glaring needs for a playmaker, quality CBs and RB upgrade were not met, talk less of adding depth to the squad or getting rid of the dead weight. Everything else was Levy cheapening out for inadequate short term patches or long term punts.

Wonder if any other club with top 4 ambitions utilizes loans as much as we seem to do these days
 
El Magnifico said:
The only thing we got that could count towards a rebuild was a DM (PEH), LB (Reguilon) and RW (Bergwijn). The glaring needs for a playmaker, quality CBs and RB upgrade were not met, talk less of adding depth to the squad or getting rid of the dead weight. Everything else was Levy cheapening out for inadequate short term patches or long term punts.

Wonder if any other club with top 4 ambitions utilizes loans as much as we seem to do these days
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"glaring needs for a playmaker" " cheapening out " " short term patches"

Not sure if it passed you by; but we spend 65m on Ndombele and put him on a salary to rival Kane, and spent 45m+ on GLC.

Fans have been quick to point out that neither is a B2B or defensive midfielder; so this means they are destined as a playmaker. However, we have seen that neither of them are particularly good at that.

You can't blame Levy for not spending to get players in. You can blame our scouts for finding lemons.

"getting rid of the dead weight."

Thats the funny thing with dead weight. Nobody wants to buy your sh!te. Who's realistically going to sign Sissoko on 100k a week? Risk Lamela with his injury record? Sign Rose with his attitude? Pay 40m+ for Sanchez who cannot stop tripping over his own feet?

" CBs and RB upgrade were not met"

Aurier was one of the best defensive RBs in the league last year. Doherty was an odd signing at 29 years old; but his Wolves performances suggested he was a shreud signing.
 
harry7 said:
"glaring needs for a playmaker" " cheapening out " " short term patches"

Not sure if it passed you by; but we spend 65m on Ndombele and put him on a salary to rival Kane, and spent 45m+ on GLC.

Fans have been quick to point out that neither is a B2B or defensive midfielder; so this means they are destined as a playmaker. However, we have seen that neither of them are particularly good at that.

You can't blame Levy for not spending to get players in. You can blame our scouts for finding lemons.

"getting rid of the dead weight."

Thats the funny thing with dead weight. Nobody wants to buy your sh!te. Who's realistically going to sign Sissoko on 100k a week? Risk Lamela with his injury record? Sign Rose with his attitude? Pay 40m+ for Sanchez who cannot stop tripping over his own feet?

" CBs and RB upgrade were not met"

Aurier was one of the best defensive RBs in the league last year. Doherty was an odd signing at 29 years old; but his Wolves performances suggested he was a shreud signing.
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Firstly, the discussion was regarding the last transfer window in which neither Ndombele nor GLC were acquired in. AFAIK GLC cost us about £27m but, more importantly, neither GLC nor Ndombele is a true playmaker i.e. a player that dictates the tempo of the team, the role (that Dembele played in the past). That is a big part of why our possession is poor and attack lacks rhythm

The cheapening out is regarding the loan signings (Gedson, Vinicius, Bale), bargain bin shopping (Doherty, Hart) and punts (Rondo). The dead weight did not sign themselves to those sweet contracts, and could have been sold/forced out earlier if Levy was willing to take the financial hit. Thats what top clubs do to keep their squad in competitive state.

A player like Aurier, who gaurantees you a boneheaded play almost every other week, is not what you want as your starting RB if you have title ambitions. I cant think of any other top team with such a player in their starting XI. If you want an upgrade on Aurier, you dont sign a 29yrs old Doherty whose only advantage over Aurier is hopefully being more level headed - excluding the boneheaded plays, Aurier is a better RB than Doherty.
 
Igula said:
If that were the case Rangnick has a zero pound buyout and doubtful he would cost 10 million a year.

Parker and Potter each would have a small buyout and nowhere near a 10 million salary either.

If we are paying anything close to 25 million we are getting a world class manager, likely Nagelsmann that is going to be worth every penny we pay with the upgrade he will provide over Jose
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El Magnifico said:
and Leicester won the league
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Shows the value of a good scouting network, Levy has only had 20 odd years to get ours sorted. They have not just vanished back to the championship like many suggested..
Like it or not they have not turned out to be flukey mugs , they are a well run club. They buy cheap and well , sell high regularly something Baldy might want to try.
 
Ed Vanderlay said:
Shows the value of a good scouting network, Levy has only had 20 odd years to get ours sorted. They have not just vanished back to the championship like many suggested..
Like it or not they have not turned out to be flukey mugs , they are a well run club. They buy cheap and well , sell high regularly something Baldy might want to try.
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"They buy cheap and well , sell high regularly something Baldy might want to try."

Erm.....Levy wrote the book on this!

Trippier 4m --> 22m
Eriksen 14m --> 27m
Bale 14m --> 101m
Stamboili 6m --> 8m
Chadlii 8m --> 15m
Walker 5m --> 52m
Pienaar 3.6m --> 5.7m
 
VonnegutBusy said:
I think Winks' homegrown status is pretty much all he has going for him at this point. I don't think it's feasible to keep him here as a 6th choice option because he can go and play at a lower level and we could probably still get a decent fee.

Dier is fine to have as a 3rd/4th choice CB.
Davies 3rd choice LB/ emergency CB cover - fine.
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I agree with you regarding Winks. If he would not be HG, he would be gone for sure.

And also, we could get decent fee for him. But this depends on developements on other fronts.
- if we also bring in AM (which would decrease need of playing Ndombele / Lo Celso there)
- what happens to Lo Celso health - let's face it; right now Winks would be 5th choice, cause Lo Celso is only option for people in treatment rooms
- if we bring in an additional CM at all and how he settles in

If Lo Celso recovers and we bring in new CM+AM - sure, Winks would be not needed.
But if Lo Celso stays out / gets injured often and we get either CM or AM; I'd keep him around until they settle in.
 
Ed Vanderlay said:
Shows the value of a good scouting network, Levy has only had 20 odd years to get ours sorted. They have not just vanished back to the championship like many suggested..
Like it or not they have not turned out to be flukey mugs , they are a well run club. They buy cheap and well , sell high regularly something Baldy might want to try.
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The point I was making was that just cos you have done something in the past doesnt mean you can do it easily in the future.

Woolwich used to be top 2, then top 4. Now they look like a midtable club and who knows, might join the relegation battle in the future.

Finishing top 4 in the past does not mean doing so in the future will be easy, more so when one considers we have been finishing lower over each of the past 4 seasons (2nd, 3rd, 4th, 6th)
 
Spursidol said:
permanently move on Sanchez, Doherty, Sissoko and Moura/Lamela that would already be huge

Absolutely agree, however all on good wages, which I fear other clubs will not want to pay so without subsidising the remaining years of their contracts. its going to be difficult to move them on.

I think we will be lucky to move on half of them this summer, sadly .
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I get your point, and in terms of outcome, the impact could well be as you described. But I wanted to explain slight flaw in your logic - specifically "subsidising their wages" -that is an overblown issue with againg superstars on giga salaries, a'la Bale or one other Sanchez or James when he moved to Everton. Here we are talking about players on 250k per week or more and hold absolutely 0 value (frozen out of the team). But that scenario does not apply to any of the players I mentioned.

If we think like Moura for example then it means roughly something like this - he could be on 100 k per week with us. And he could be worth 20 mil for some other team. But this team would be willing to pay him say 65 k per week on 3 year salary. That makes a difference of 35 k per week; or 1,8 mil per year. Multiply it with 3 and you get 5,4 mil eur as difference of wage we are paying and what buyer would be willing to pay. Then subtract this 5,4 mil from their preceived valuation - 20-5,4 = 16,6 mil. Transfer price would just decrease in such scenarios eg if players are paid above market level we will get price that is below market level for them. Specific numbers might change (it could be that preceived value is 15 and we get 10; or clubs are willing to pay 70k then value is decreased less etc), but the logic remains the same.

I would expect that we can move Doherty on for similar cost that we purchased him for; about Moura - I presented my estimation; Sanchez... I really hope someone from Italy (come on, even Fazio and Chiriches were half-successful there) could cough up like 20-25 mil for him; Sissoko... maybe someone pays like 15? So in this (I agree quite optimistic scenario) we could maybe get 10+15+20+15 for them. Total of 60 mil? Plus we can get something for Foyth and Gazza - maybe total of 70-75 mil? Then at least 40-45 mil should be added from some... magical sources. Cause if we'd have 120 mil and we'd need to bring in top quality CB (like Skriniar); CM (like Sarbitzer) and Winger/ST (like... I am not sure really) ... roughly 40 mil for each. Plus Skipp and Sessegnon in for Sissoko and Moura. Damn, that looks tough to pull off even on paper to be honest.
 
TheSpurEst said:
I get your point, and in terms of outcome, the impact could well be as you described. But I wanted to explain slight flaw in your logic - specifically "subsidising their wages" -that is an overblown issue with againg superstars on giga salaries, a'la Bale or one other Sanchez or James when he moved to Everton. Here we are talking about players on 250k per week or more and hold absolutely 0 value (frozen out of the team). But that scenario does not apply to any of the players I mentioned.

If we think like Moura for example then it means roughly something like this - he could be on 100 k per week with us. And he could be worth 20 mil for some other team. But this team would be willing to pay him say 65 k per week on 3 year salary. That makes a difference of 35 k per week; or 1,8 mil per year. Multiply it with 3 and you get 5,4 mil eur as difference of wage we are paying and what buyer would be willing to pay. Then subtract this 5,4 mil from their preceived valuation - 20-5,4 = 16,6 mil. Transfer price would just decrease in such scenarios eg if players are paid above market level we will get price that is below market level for them. Specific numbers might change (it could be that preceived value is 15 and we get 10; or clubs are willing to pay 70k then value is decreased less etc), but the logic remains the same.

I would expect that we can move Doherty on for similar cost that we purchased him for; about Moura - I presented my estimation; Sanchez... I really hope someone from Italy (come on, even Fazio and Chiriches were half-successful there) could cough up like 20-25 mil for him; Sissoko... maybe someone pays like 15? So in this (I agree quite optimistic scenario) we could maybe get 10+15+20+15 for them. Total of 60 mil? Plus we can get something for Foyth and Gazza - maybe total of 70-75 mil? Then at least 40-45 mil should be added from some... magical sources. Cause if we'd have 120 mil and we'd need to bring in top quality CB (like Skriniar); CM (like Sarbitzer) and Winger/ST (like... I am not sure really) ... roughly 40 mil for each. Plus Skipp and Sessegnon in for Sissoko and Moura. Damn, that looks tough to pull off even on paper to be honest.
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Thanks, generally agree, but thought I'd draw your attention to note 16 on Page 30 of the Spurs annual accounts to 30 June 2020.

You will see there that Spurs have made a provision for wages on employment contracts totaling £ 28.7m, and all/most of that will be for wages which Spurs estimate they will need to meet as the wages are above what the market will pay on players Spurs would like to upgrade on. So it may be a choice of language, but not sure I've been too overblown !

With those sort of sums it has to be on a good half dozen players.

And if a buying club are not prepared to meet high wages its likely they will not pay high fees on.

So, yes I agree we have a decent chance of getting most or all of our money back on the reputed £16m fee for Doherty, but maybe not all his wages if we gave him a big wage increase to come (despite some fans comments are about 5th/6th highest players in UK and probably top dozen in Europe, so other clubs will not want to pay as high as us), we may find a wage subsidy is needed.

Lamela (only fit a third of the time) we may find needs a wage subsidy to move etc.

So as I said, I'm expecting it to be a problem to move on some players due to their current wages, and we will struggle to get high fees. And if we do need to pay £28.7m in wage subsidies.....in totay's market that might represent the fees we would have paid to buy 2 players.

IMO its going to be a tough transfer window.
 
If we could do something similar this year that would be great, in terms of the numbers not the quality of guys brought in.

6 in, 12 out seems to be just about exactly what we need.
 
Igula said:
If we could do something similar this year that would be great, in terms of the numbers not the quality of guys brought in.

6 in, 12 out seems to be just about exactly what we need.
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Going to be really tough shifting players unless loans. I cant see many clubs stumping up cash, certainly not on some we're looking to shift. The good thing is Rose, Bale and Vinicius will be gone so thats a start. Last year of contract for Aurier, Lamela so we should just get rid for whatever we can get. Hugo's last year so a decision needs to be made there. I'd like to add Sissoko, Moura and Sanchez to the outs at the very least but thats when it gets tricky with Levy wanting likely big money. There are others if we get a reasonable offer like Doherty, Dier, Toby, Winks that might go.
 
Oracle said:
What's the record for ins and outs for Premier League teams in one window?
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I can see you are a man who doesn't remember Frankie's Funtime Fridays in 2005.

20+ new players came in split between first team and reserves (young prospects).

Some good (eg Carrick £4m) many not so, and all inexpensive.

But good enough squad for Jol to lead us from perennial mid table to 5th place in 2 successive seasons (best finish we had for 20 years at that time)
 
According to today's "gossip" We are prepared to listen to offers for Harry Kane at the 150 million mark. Mbappe is 173 million.

Swap deal + 23 million?

Poch would love Kane...

A straight "No fucking way" from Mbappe i fear though.

Nice to dream.
 
stuart3455 said:
According to today's "gossip" We are prepared to listen to offers for Harry Kane at the 150 million mark. Mbappe is 173 million.

Swap deal + 23 million?

Poch would love Kane...

A straight "No fucking way" from Mbappe i fear though.

Nice to dream.
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Read that Juve is chasing Son and willing to pay upto 90M Euros.

Son has refused to sign a new contract..there is a possibility Levy will cash in, maybe 50M + Rabiot ?
 
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