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Transfers Summer Transfer thread - 2024

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How Dry should our Powder be?

  • Total voters
    57
TheSpurEst said:
Do you watch games or listen/read interviews?
Because if answer is 1st, you might have noticed that Bissouma role throughout the season WAS different to what Sarr was doing. I mean VERY different.

Sure other midfielders can happen to be in that position once or twice in game, but #6 position in Ange system is visibly different with it's requirements.
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I go to games live thanks.

So if it's sooooo visibly different with its requirements then why is an 8 our main centre midfielder target and why has our own manager gone on record specifically stating he does not see poitions in regards to a 6/8.

Can anyone provide a heat map for our players the whole of last season? is that something that's available.
 
Guido 🇺🇦 said:
Big chance definition: "A situation where a player should reasonably be expected to score, usually in a one on one scenario or from very close range when the ball has a clear path to goal and there is low to moderate pressure on the shooter". (Penalties are always considered big chances but seeing as we only had 2 of them awarded to us all of last season it only emphasises and underlines just how fucking good we are at creating them!!!

We should convert more of these chances simply by having Solanke in the team (and by having Solonke and keeping Richie it also means less pressure for Richie to play if not 100% fit, so when he is rotated he should be even better as more injury free).

But having Solanke a proper number 9 again also means Son being played in his best position, and Solanke is able to link play which in turn means even more chances of creation and maybe goals from Son and the rest of the attacking players.

It means he improves our attacking output and our output is already one of the best in the league before he joined us.

Of course there are still loads to address and improve how we attack but Solonke alone should convert a higher % of chances, that alone moves the needle for us - turning draws and some losses into wins (Brentford, Woolwich away, even the Chav 9 man game, Wolves, Villa, West Ham x2, Liverpool away) at least 10 more points IMO.

So now we address the other major problem and that's oppo transitions against us and a 1v1 dribbly winger doesn't do this. (I still absolutely want one because we don't have someone who does this) but if we want to move the needle to make our biggest improvement then it's stopping oppo transitions becoming big chances against us.

If we've just added more goals by hiring Solanke (I'm as sure as I can be we have) and we can address conceding fewer goals (fewer big chances) from oppo transitions then we will be a better team. Focusing on a better #8 than Sarr will achieve this. (Ange's system is open as he commits many players forward so we will concede more chances than a less risk-averse team) but score 15 more, concede 20 fewer and we will be a top 3 side.

A 1v1 winger whilst absolutely needed doesn't address our biggest problem (Solanke will address us converting more chances), getting in an aggressive cunty #8 (that's why Ange likes Gallagher - people may dislike him but none of them can say Sarr is better with a straight face) will go a long way to addressing this weakness and thus make us a better side (WIN MORE FUCKING GAMES).
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Yes, I do agree with part of having Solanke as #9 option will mean more chances put away, more goals scored + also that we have striker who can keep the ball upfield more successfully than players we used in last season.

No argument there - he is an improvement in that area. Also very likely that adding him will make us better in set pieces (with his height and strength).

I agree with also the latter part of what you say- about stopping opposition transitions. But also better performing #6 will help to address this.

I did not say that sharp winger will help with transitions directly, but there is an indirect effect. By the end of last season opposition teams started to leave wings open on purpose. Cause Kulu poised no threat at all. That meant opposition teams were able to allocate more resources to quick transition. Now if we'd upgrade and have in form Eze instead of Kulusevski on the wing, oppositions would have to reconsider, how much room can be left there.

So again - I agree with our aims but what I am trying to say is that there are more than one way to solve these problems. I watched in some games how Emerson played, how much ground he covered and I am fairly sure he'd do better job in closing some channels and winning ball back in midfield.
 
TheSpurEst said:
Do you watch games or listen/read interviews?
Because if answer is 1st, you might have noticed that Bissouma role throughout the season WAS different to what Sarr was doing. I mean VERY different.

Sure other midfielders can happen to be in that position once or twice in game, but #6 position in Ange system is visibly different with it's requirements.
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That role at the base of midfield is such a tough one to play in anges system. You need to be able to constantly get the ball of the back 4 or goalkeeper in tight situations, beat a press and play accurate forward passes.

The only ones who have the ability do it consistently are biss and Maddison (who often comes deep to pick up the ball) Thats why I keep saying just swapping Maddison for eze is going to change up the dynamic in the midfield quite drastically as not sure eze will get as involved in build up play.

Maybe bergvall will show over time he has that ability too. At the moment I see him as a good all rounder as he is great at winning the ball higher up the pitch, similar to Bentancur
 
Guido 🇺🇦 said:
I would agree with that, I think the transition from Champ to PL has the biggest step up when looking at the time you get on the ball and how aggressively you are pressed, I don't have an issue with his ability with the ball at his feet, that #6 position for us though is fucking hard for anyone playing in our system, it's basically them and x2 CB's, so knowing when to pressure the oppo or drop back in position is the difference between an oppo goal scored or not. But I would be surprised to see him play there in the PL (and yes I'm passing that purely off his Bayern performance so a big pinch of salt from me. But it did show just how far off it he was). I loved everything else he's done in preseason.

I'm simply not impressed with what Sarr brings on the ball, he's had some nice moments but by and large, he needs to keep possession better and be more aggressive in spotting and shutting down oppo transitions (again, don't want to entirely chuck him under the bus here as Ange's system will always leave us open to this more so than a less risk-averse deeper #8).

By way of an example and this one is for the haters, imagine Gallagher playing instead of Sarr. He's marginally better than Sarr in all the things Sarr is good at, but he miles better than him in disrupting oppo build-up and attacks. This is the difference from conceding 61 goals to somewhere like 45/50 goals, that alone gets us CL football back and maybe the difference required to compete better against the top 6 which might mean a trophy.
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Gallagher is not Marginally better than Sarr in all departments. He wouldn't improve us radically in anyway ( then throw in the Chelsea core he will be Jason Cundy mark two). His not smart enough at reading the play to effect the goals against to that degree. He's another box to box boy thrown under the bus by the demands of a system that hurts this kind of player explicitly. Genuinely think Ederson from what I've seen would be most impactful in terms of not simply bustling about like lungs on legs, reads the game better than Sarr or Gallagher.
 
kingdawson said:
I go to games live thanks.

So if it's sooooo visibly different with its requirements then why is an 8 our main centre midfielder target and why has our own manager gone on record specifically stating he does not see poitions in regards to a 6/8.

Can anyone provide a heat map for our players the whole of last season? is that something that's available.
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I personally think that managers can also be wrong at times. If Ange says that he targets another #8 I can still be in position that this is wrong way to address problems.

I was watching heatmaps and average positions from Whoscored but previous season games are difficult to find there. I remember watching them last season and at least when we were doing well, #6 position differed VISIBLY from other midfielder positions. But if someone can find and share links where we could see accurate heatmaps / avg positions from last season, I'd be happy to revisit too.
 
TheSpurEst said:
I personally think that managers can also be wrong at times. If Ange says that he targets another #8 I can still be in position that this is wrong way to address problems.

I was watching heatmaps and average positions from Whoscored but previous season games are difficult to find there. I remember watching them last season and at least when we were doing well, #6 position differed VISIBLY from other midfielder positions. But if someone can find and share links where we could see accurate heatmaps / avg positions from last season, I'd be happy to revisit too.
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You're missing the point. He "targets another 8" in your eyes but in Ange's eyes he targets another centre midfielder that can contribute defensively, be effective in regards to ball retention and can contribute in an attacking sense. He targets well rounded central midfielders in order to share the workload . The "6" is still required to contribute in the attacking phase of play, the "8" is required to contribute defensively.
 
GGTH said:
First figure is net.
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Duck Dynasty GIF by DefyTV



It's throwing in players we agreed to sign before Ange arrived, so don't think for a moment that it is or isn't accurately recording outgoings fairly.
 
Starks said:
I always thought the point of the winger we all desire was to actually limit the oppositions chances due to there being fewer turnovers in the final third because Kulusevski and Johnson too readily give away possession.

Not just to strictly create more chances but to be able to keep hold of the ball or simply just do better with it.

Alot of the goals we conceded last season that weren't set pieces were down to counters stemming from our front line losing the ball too easily. Son failing to hold the ball up against Newcastle twice. Kulusevski aimlessly giving the ball away against Luton. Losing it again against Woolwich to name four off the top of my head.

Now Solanke should definitely help with keeping the ball. But I think the wide players need to better and will need to be improved. Even Son is far too sloppy in possession.

If we've got the ball, the opponents haven't mantra.
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But conversely, Kulu and Werner win the ball back higher up the pitch more than anyone else. And our press, which is one of the best in the League has just got a hell of a lot better by adding Solanke who is one of the best pressing CF's in the league.

Perhaps I'm being over-optimistic but I see us having a fit (please God don't jinx this) number 9 as transformative for us. Not only is he going to be better than every player we played there last season (Richie was good when he played, but the problem was he didn't play that often) for scoring chances created (and we create loads) but as you rightly say Son, Werner, Johnson and to some extent Kulu don't excel in holding the ball up (I thought Kulu was good or at least miles better than anyone else when played centrally). But having Son back in his best position (perhaps also us being able to rotate him more now too is also key - he looks to have lost a lot of his pace) all playing around Solanke is huge. We also have someone to head the fucking thing too.

So, without the ball our press high up the pitch which is one of the best should be even more improved. I'm not that fussed about their ball retention anymore because Solanke is great at it.

The concern for me isn't about our forwards losing possession now that Solanke is here, it's about dealing with the transition that happens when they do, yes I guess you're going to argue this is negated by not having them lose possession in the first place, but I don't see that as realistic expectation, all forwards lose the ball more than any other players because they tend to be outnumbered numerically and are having to try riskier things.

My focus is to have a better player than Sarr (who I like) and I think this would be as transformative as getting in a fit competent all-round CF. A player that improves us in this position who is just 10% better than Sarr (keeps the ball/looks after the ball better/can drop into the pivot that Biss fills to collect the ball of CB's and GK with his back to goal/and is a bit of an aggressive cunt who can spot and smother a counter before it happens) will improve us by addressing our biggest weakness.

Whilst the need for a 1v1 dribbler is absolutely there, it doesn't transform us in a bigger way than getting in a better #8 than Sarr. (If we are in the market for both then happy days).
 
kingdawson said:
I go to games live thanks.

So if it's sooooo visibly different with its requirements then why is an 8 our main centre midfielder target and why has our own manager gone on record specifically stating he does not see poitions in regards to a 6/8.

Can anyone provide a heat map for our players the whole of last season? is that something that's available.
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Bissouma:

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Sarr:

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Maddison:

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Just for clarification, because EPL rules allow transferred players to be classed as U21, we currently have 16 NHG and 9 HG players in the squad of 25
So, in theory, we could keep all our current players, including Phillips, but just not register them for Europe.
 
TheSpurEst said:
Yes, I do agree with part of having Solanke as #9 option will mean more chances put away, more goals scored + also that we have striker who can keep the ball upfield more successfully than players we used in last season.

No argument there - he is an improvement in that area. Also very likely that adding him will make us better in set pieces (with his height and strength).

I agree with also the latter part of what you say- about stopping opposition transitions. But also better performing #6 will help to address this.

I did not say that sharp winger will help with transitions directly, but there is an indirect effect. By the end of last season opposition teams started to leave wings open on purpose. Cause Kulu poised no threat at all. That meant opposition teams were able to allocate more resources to quick transition. Now if we'd upgrade and have in form Eze instead of Kulusevski on the wing, oppositions would have to reconsider, how much room can be left there.

So again - I agree with our aims but what I am trying to say is that there are more than one way to solve these problems. I watched in some games how Emerson played, how much ground he covered and I am fairly sure he'd do better job in closing some channels and winning ball back in midfield.
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We already have one of the best #6's in the league.....
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Both he and the CBs are all we leave back, if an oppo has transitioned against these 3 we are limited to its effectiveness, this is how we have chosen to play. BUT we can affect the oppo by not allowing that transition to build, this is where a better, more aggressive and cunter #8 comes in (BTW I think Bentancur is actually got a lot of the attributes I'm looking for here, he's better than Sarr on the ball and he's more aggressive than him too, I'm not sure he has Sarr's legs to get up and down the pitch and provide 3rd man runs behind oppo but I'd start him ahead of Sarr in a heartbeat).

By the end of last season, Kulu was playing as a Centre Forward or false 9 and we were better for it.

Again, this isn't saying we shouldn't get better wingers, we absolutely should, I also think the Club acknowledges this as to why Werner is on loan and not permanent. All I'm trying to articulate is where can we make our biggest improvement, and having got Solanke we've fixed a huge number of areas upfront with just one hire (this isn't the end but it should have a huge uptick for us both with and without the ball) the other big area dealing with our biggest weakness, putting Rodri in as #6 wouldn't change things, he will still be dealing with multiple transitions with just him and 2 CB's, but having a player in front to snuff or disrupt oppo transitions before they begin is transformative, and will prevent 10-15 gaols against us (being able to defend and score from set-pieces is also right up there too).

Solanke improves our press, which also improves our defence but because of how we commit numbers forward I'm convinced we go a very long way to addressing our biggest weakness which in turn means has the biggest impact on us winning more games.

It doesn't mean in any way I don't want a dribbly winger, I absolutely do but I don't think it has as big an impact/transformative on our performances as getting a better #8 than Sarr (and I stress I love Sarr).
 
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