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todd1882

'Cause I know the power of the question
The fact of the matter is that I need to expand my database.

Watching Sabitzer closely, I see that he does not want to receive the ball under pressure. You know what that kind of thing does to me.
Was just giving you shit. I think it's a fun exercise but I didn't feel many would do it.

Why is there such a hefty price tag on Kabak? Watched him against RBL, and he did 5 or 6 things that worried me.
I guess it's because he is a 19yo CB and he also does a few things that are good. I like him and am interested in seeing more and will. That was a horrible 'tumble' he took. I would have considered him in my team but BC did say 'realistic' and they are not letting him go...and we'd rather waste another 3 years on making a decision on Sanchez that I was comfortable making a couple years ago.
 
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Five

Supporter
Was just giving you shit. I think it's a fun exercise but I didn't feel many would do it.
That's fair enough. This is my first season watching Ligue 1 and BuLi. I barely watch any La Liga or Serie A. And I haven't heard of a lot of the names being thrown around by guys like you and reachingforthestars.

That was a horrible 'tumble' he took.
In the clips I put together? Dived in a bit, and got it badly wrong.

70 mins into this Eintracht Frankfurt v RBL game, and my boner for Sabitzer has shriveled into nothing. When RBL's CBs are playing out from the back, he does not show for the ball at all. He is, as you might say, a counter-attacking player.

It is remarkable what Nagelsmann can do with 2 CMs (Laimer and Sabitzer) who do not want the ball from their CBs. That is a hell of a handicap to have. But they (RBL) do everything in numbers; they are quite exhilarating in that regard.
 
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todd1882

'Cause I know the power of the question
That's fair enough. This is my first season watching Ligue 1 and BuLi. I barely watch any La Liga or Serie A. And I haven't heard of a lot of the names being thrown around by guys like you and reachingforthestars.
I watch NO Serie A. No time and just no fun anyway. But I think my 'pick a team' and watch all their games plan is inspired if I say so myself. And though I am a HLM (as I am told) I'd like to think I'm being objective there. I watched that Rennes-Nantes game somewhat because of this.

In the clips I put together? Dived in a bit, and got it badly wrong.
I know nothing of your clips.

70 mins into this Eintracht Frankfurt v RBL game, and my boner for Sabitzer has shriveled into nothing. When RBL's CBs are playing out from the back, he does not show for the ball at all. He is, as you might say, a counter-attacking player.
Will DL be considering things like this when the price is 'right'?

It is remarkable what Nagelsmann can do with 2 CMs (Laimer and Sabitzer) who do not want the ball from their CBs. That is a hell of a handicap to have. But they (RBL) do everything in numbers; they are quite exhilarating in that regard.
He puts his players into positions and tactical setups to succeed. I like him. I still never would have switched Poch for him (loyalty may be my downfall as well) but I sure as fuck would have taken him immediately afterward. I was crushed when I was taking in a Hoffenheim game and they mention he signed that early contract...to fucking RBL. But truth be told it's a perfect situation for him. Glad he didn't go directly to Bayern (if that is his desire).
 
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todd1882

'Cause I know the power of the question
They're on the transfer thread.
Yeah, I'm there trying to catch up AND respond to the absolute bollocks that BC posted, again, while also keeping my train of thought and making my post intelligible...and you keep pulling me out of that.

Because of what?
Well, I was following Rennes somewhat since you suggested. But also because it was a derby, I've been keeping tabs on Blas since he was 1 of my Guingamp 3, and I wanted to concentrate on Louza. Mulitiple reasons but 15 birds with 1 stone on the other side of the fence in the green grass with the spilled milk.
 
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TommyD123

Supporter
I wouldn’t go crazy with a total overhaul. Despite how shite it’s felt like we’ve been for the last year or so, talent wise I still feel we’ve got the 3rd best squad in the league.

Would get rid of those in bold below which would generate £70m (I’m not counting the £10m allocated for Jan given his contract).
Hardest of those to decide on was Moura - torn between him and Alli who I’m not sure where he fits if we play our best suited formations - but ultimately there’s a world class player in there.

So with £170m I would then sign Foster (free) Aarons (£30m), Atal (£40m), Partey (£50m), Matuidi (free) and King (£20m). Leaving £30m free for any January additions.
GKDefendersMidfieldersAM/FWD
Lloris 18mSanchez 35mSkipp 15mSessegnon 25m
Gazzaniga 5mAlderwiereld 15mNdombele 50mAlli 55m
Vorm 0mVertonghen 10mLo Celso 50mSon 60m
Foyth 15mWinks 40mBergwijn 30m
Tanganga 10mSissoko 15mMoura 25m
Davies 15mLamela 15m
Aurier 15mKane 150m
KWP 10m
Dier 25m
 
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I wouldn’t go crazy with a total overhaul. Despite how shite it’s felt like we’ve been for the last year or so, talent wise I still feel we’ve got the 3rd best squad in the league.

Would get rid of those in bold below which would generate £70m (I’m not counting the £10m allocated for Jan given his contract).
Hardest of those to decide on was Moura - torn between him and Alli who I’m not sure where he fits if we play our best suited formations - but ultimately there’s a world class player in there.

So with £170m I would then sign Foster (free) Aarons (£30m), Atal (£40m), Partey (£50m), Matuidi (free) and King (£20m). Leaving £30m free for any January additions.
GKDefendersMidfieldersAM/FWD
Lloris 18mSanchez 35mSkipp 15mSessegnon 25m
Gazzaniga 5mAlderwiereld 15mNdombele 50mAlli 55m
Vorm 0mVertonghen 10mLo Celso 50mSon 60m
Foyth 15mWinks 40mBergwijn 30m
Tanganga 10mSissoko 15mMoura 25m
Davies 15mLamela 15m
Aurier 15mKane 150m
KWP 10m
Dier 25m
We do not have the third best squad very odd that anyone can reach that conclusion.
 
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TommyD123

Supporter
Would you swap our squad for Utd, Chelsea or Woolwich’s?
Chelsea have out played us twice so far and were unfortunate not to have won by more, utd are getting it together now, only Woolwich who are starting to get their defence right are probably as weak as us.
Wholeheartedly agree ....but would you swap their playing squads?
For me the most despicable aspect of those two Chelsea non-performances is that both times I looked at the respective teams before kick off and thought “we SHOULD have these”.

my point is, we’ve got a couple of glaring holes at Right back and defensive midfield which if fixed along with a change of tactics and attitude easily has us in the top 4
 
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Would you swap our squad for Utd, Chelsea or Woolwich’s?


Wholeheartedly agree ....but would you swap their playing squads?
For me the most despicable aspect of those two Chelsea non-performances is that both times I looked at the respective teams before kick off and thought “we SHOULD have these”.

my point is, we’ve got a couple of glaring holes at Right back and defensive midfield which if fixed along with a change of tactics and attitude easily has us in the top 4
I think we have more problems than that both RBs need changing and a DM needs to come in, but imo we still need to replace the CBs, goalkeeper and another forward is required before we get back amongst it.
 
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In
Chilwell £53m
Upamencano £55m
Donnaruma £50m
Atal: £23m
Aaron’s £25m
Partey £45m
Giroud (free)
total in: 251m

out:
lloris: £17m
Sanchez: £40m
Aurier: 15m
Lamela: 15m
Vertonghen(free)
Vorm (free)
Sissoko 15m
Walker peters 7m
Rose 13m
Winks: 40m
total out: 162m

Net spend: 89m


1st 11
Donnaruma
Chilwell. Upmencenco. Toby. Atal
Partey
Lo celso Alli
Son. Kane. Bergwijn

2nd 11
Gazzaniga
Davies. Foyth. Tanganga. Aaron’s
Dier
Gedson. Ndombele
Lucas. Giroud. Sessegnon
 
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I think we have more problems than that both RBs need changing and a DM needs to come in, but imo we still need to replace the CBs, goalkeeper and another forward is required before we get back amongst it.
The DM role is vital. It was a long time ago but I remember us being all over the place like now and we brought in Terry Yorath as DM and the change in our performance and results was startling. Redknapp did the same when he arrived bringing in a new DM in the first transfer window. Yes it looks like we need numerous changes but get the right DM in and some of the other problems will reduce.
 
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The DM role is vital. It was a long time ago but I remember us being all over the place like now and we brought in Terry Yorath as DM and the change in our performance and results was startling. Redknapp did the same when he arrived bringing in a new DM in the first transfer window. Yes it looks like we need numerous changes but get the right DM in and some of the other problems will reduce.
Cor your going back to the 80s I do remember that but yes the DM position is vital, although that doesn't stop poor positional sense of our full backs nor does that stop our keepers from spilling or failing to save easy shots.
 
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TommyD123

Supporter
I think we have more problems than that both RBs need changing and a DM needs to come in, but imo we still need to replace the CBs, goalkeeper and another forward is required before we get back amongst it.
You’ve not answered my question tho about whether you’d swap our squad with Utd, Chavs or Woolwich?
I’m far from happy with the state of things at the club at the minute. But I still think we’ve got more talent overall than those 3 - which makes the current predicament worse.

Poch’s best years came when we clearly had a squad for 4th-6th but were competing for the title those 2 years. That was an overachievement whereas now I think we’re underachieving with what we have!
 
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You’ve not answered my question tho about whether you’d swap our squad with Utd, Chavs or Woolwich?
I’m far from happy with the state of things at the club at the minute. But I still think we’ve got more talent overall than those 3 - which makes the current predicament worse.

Poch’s best years came when we clearly had a squad for 4th-6th but were competing for the title those 2 years. That was an overachievement whereas now I think we’re underachieving with what we have!
Probably would swap some of our squad out yes although I don't think we was ever in a title race previously as you mentioned.
As for our current situation I think we are where we should be considering the poor investment in the squad prior to last summer.
 
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Prices according to .transfermarkt.com/
In
Donnaruma €55.00m
Theo Hernández €40.00m
Éder Militão €40.00m
Atal: £23m
Nathan Ferguson - €4.50m
Ibrahim Sangaré - €12.00m
Allan Saint-Maximin - £25m or adama traora -€40.00m
Eberechi Eze €10m
Mounir Chouiar - €8.00m
total in: 232.5m or 217.5M ( 206M£ - 192.7M£)

out:
lloris: £17m
Aurier: 15m
Lamela: 15m
Vertonghen(free)
Vorm (free)
Sissoko 15m
Walker peters 7m
Rose 13m
Winks: 40m
Davies : 15M
total out: £137m

net : £55.7M - £69M
 
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Following on from the discussion with reachingforthestars reachingforthestars :

Having watched Todibo's home debut live, and then 3/4 of his subsequent few games for Toulouse, I posted a little heads up in the Players Worth Keeping an Eye On thread in Sep 2018, saying he has some good qualities.


I think they subsequently stopped picking him because he'd refused to sign a contract with because he'd got wind of Barca sniffing, they were going to wait until summer 2019 to bring in in for free, but decided to pay 1m and bring him in January.

After making 2 appearances in La Liga back end of 18/19, he made 2 more the front end of 19/20 before going to Schalke on loan in January 2020. Here's the thing, apparently it's a loan with a 25+5m buy out clause.

I decided to watch a couple of games to see how he's looking after playing so little football (4 league games in 2019). Got to say, from the two games I've watched so far, there's a lot to like.

He's got all the physical/athletic attributes you want for a CB. Tall, strong, pretty quick, and mobile upper and lower body. He generally does well in physical duels and tussles.

Changes direction pretty well. He's aggressive and tenacious.

He seems to read the game pretty well, he looks around to check what's going on defensively and repositions. I'm not sure, I need to watch some more games, but maybe he can lose concentration on the odd occasion between phases of play, but he is only 20yo and I'm not even sure it's endemic, or just situational and due to inexperience.

Defensively what I like most is he's proactive not just reactive in his defending. He sees what's happening and uses his speed, aggression and dexterity to press up and win the ball, cut moves/breaks off early and he has the common sense to take the free kick if it means stopping a break, knowing he can get away with this in advanced areas of the pitch. He's got a brain.

But where this boy really fucking excels is with the ball. I can't remember seeing too many CB's - especially aged 20 having their first handful of games - be this technically adept and confident on the ball.

I've seen him come unstuck a couple of times, he got a bit bullied in one passage of play by Lukaku in the Inter v Barca game, but Lukaku can be a bit of monster and Todibo is only 20yo and has only played about 20 league games in France, Spain, Germany spread over two seasons.

I think for 25+5m he's an absolute fucking steal - 40m for Sanxhez, 80m McGuire, - there's a bit of the VVD about him and at 20yo has bags of development and improvement in him.

This first bunch of clips shows him up against Martinez/Inter who's a real fucking livewire, and despite him making life difficult, Todibo generally handles him, doesn't really lose any of the duels, using a combination of physicality and tenacity/dexterity to come on largely on top (even though one of them subsequently leads to a Likaku scoring, it wasn't down to Todibo who wins his duel).

Also bare in mind this is a 20yo playing the biggest game of his young career (and about his 15th career game).




This one he deals with Lukaku


More examples of Todibo's combination of anticipation, aggression and strength to win duels:


These clips show him reading the play and using his speed and tenacity to squeeze up and suffocate breaks before they happen. I really like a CB who can do this without fear of getting spun. Players like Dier and Alderweireld just can't do this, for fear of being spun and left for dead.


And these are some of my favourites, showing his composure and technical ability when in possession. We have players playing as CM's over the last three years that don't have this, let alone CB's. There are very few CB's around this comfortable on the ball, and it's not just that he's technically comfortable, he sprints away from pressing oppo's and then plays good vertical passes. Composure, pace and passing under pressure. Imagine Sanchez doing this (or any of our current bunch of CB's)


This was the only real negative moment I could find. He gets out muscled by Lukaku. Not great, but I've seen others bullied by Lukaku, and again, he is still 20yo and learning. At 20yo VVD was playing for Gronigan and then Celtic. This is a 20yo playing away at Inter.



Here's some bonus clips from him paying for Schalke away at Cologne. Showing many of the same types of traits, plus a long raking diagonal that goes straight to feet, which we didn't see against Inter:



Bottom line, I think this kid is well worth a punt at 30-40m. I'd be all over this if Schalke either choose not to or even of they do, offer them a chance to make a quick 15m. Even if the kid turns out not to be the next greatest thing, he's got enough about him to be a very good CB (or even a DM) and some unique qualities. A rare combo of athletic/Physical and cerebral/technical. I can see why he found his way onto Barca's radar before he'd even kicked a ball, I'm just not sure why they are prepared to offload him already, although they will make a quick 24m? I need to watch some more games where he's under more pressure, and will update if I find more weaknesses.
 
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