You're The DOF

  • The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss the latest matches, our players and any transfer news surrounding Spurs. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts. You're here now, you might as well...

    Get involved!

Following on from the discussion with reachingforthestars reachingforthestars :

Having watched Todibo's home debut live, and then 3/4 of his subsequent few games for Toulouse, I posted a little heads up in the Players Worth Keeping an Eye On thread in Sep 2018, saying he has some good qualities.


I think they subsequently stopped picking him because he'd refused to sign a contract with because he'd got wind of Barca sniffing, they were going to wait until summer 2019 to bring in in for free, but decided to pay 1m and bring him in January.

After making 2 appearances in La Liga back end of 18/19, he made 2 more the front end of 19/20 before going to Schalke on loan in January 2020. Here's the thing, apparently it's a loan with a 25+5m buy out clause.

I decided to watch a couple of games to see how he's looking after playing so little football (4 league games in 2019). Got to say, from the two games I've watched so far, there's a lot to like.

He's got all the physical/athletic attributes you want for a CB. Tall, strong, pretty quick, and mobile upper and lower body. He generally does well in physical duels and tussles.

Changes direction pretty well. He's aggressive and tenacious.

He seems to read the game pretty well, he looks around to check what's going on defensively and repositions. I'm not sure, I need to watch some more games, but maybe he can lose concentration on the odd occasion between phases of play, but he is only 20yo and I'm not even sure it's endemic, or just situational and due to inexperience.

Defensively what I like most is he's proactive not just reactive in his defending. He sees what's happening and uses his speed, aggression and dexterity to press up and win the ball, cut moves/breaks off early and he has the common sense to take the free kick if it means stopping a break, knowing he can get away with this in advanced areas of the pitch. He's got a brain.

But where this boy really fucking excels is with the ball. I can't remember seeing too many CB's - especially aged 20 having their first handful of games - be this technically adept and confident on the ball.

I've seen him come unstuck a couple of times, he got a bit bullied in one passage of play by Lukaku in the Inter v Barca game, but Lukaku can be a bit of monster and Todibo is only 20yo and has only played about 20 league games in France, Spain, Germany spread over two seasons.

I think for 25+5m he's an absolute fucking steal - 40m for Sanxhez, 80m McGuire, - there's a bit of the VVD about him and at 20yo has bags of development and improvement in him.

This first bunch of clips shows him up against Martinez/Inter who's a real fucking livewire, and despite him making life difficult, Todibo generally handles him, doesn't really lose any of the duels, using a combination of physicality and tenacity/dexterity to come on largely on top (even though one of them subsequently leads to a Likaku scoring, it wasn't down to Todibo who wins his duel).

Also bare in mind this is a 20yo playing the biggest game of his young career (and about his 15th career game).




This one he deals with Lukaku


More examples of Todibo's combination of anticipation, aggression and strength to win duels:


These clips show him reading the play and using his speed and tenacity to squeeze up and suffocate breaks before they happen. I really like a CB who can do this without fear of getting spun. Players like Dier and Alderweireld just can't do this, for fear of being spun and left for dead.


And these are some of my favourites, showing his composure and technical ability when in possession. We have players playing as CM's over the last three years that don't have this, let alone CB's. There are very few CB's around this comfortable on the ball, and it's not just that he's technically comfortable, he sprints away from pressing oppo's and then plays good vertical passes. Composure, pace and passing under pressure. Imagine Sanchez doing this (or any of our current bunch of CB's)


This was the only real negative moment I could find. He gets out muscled by Lukaku. Not great, but I've seen others bullied by Lukaku, and again, he is still 20yo and learning. At 20yo VVD was playing for Gronigan and then Celtic. This is a 20yo playing away at Inter.



Here's some bonus clips from him paying for Schalke away at Cologne. Showing many of the same types of traits, plus a long raking diagonal that goes straight to feet, which we didn't see against Inter:



Bottom line, I think this kid is well worth a punt at 30-40m. I'd be all over this if Schalke either choose not to or even of they do, offer them a chance to make a quick 15m. Even if the kid turns out not to be the next greatest thing, he's got enough about him to be a very good CB and some unique qualities. A rare combo of athletic/Physical and cerebral/technical. I can see why he found his way onto Barca's dada before he'd even kicked a ball, I'm just not sure why they are prepared to offload him already, although they will make a quick 24m? I need to watch some more games where he's under more pressure, and will update if I find more weaknesses.
Nice job

I think I watched the Inter game at the time, and I weren't really blown away. Doesn't matter, I still believe he'll become a star. The VVD comparison is a good one looking at their stature and genes. Van Dijk at Celtic was a good player, but he was still doing his best Foyth impression, stepping up in challenges misreading them. At the time I was surprised Southampton got the deal and no bigger team went in for him.

So with Five Five 's question about the Kabak appeal, it's no so much about what the guys aren't doing, but more a question about what they are already capable of doing at such a young age. I'll back Todibo because of his agility (I guess that's racist - reversed). If he can work on his leadership, I can't see why he couldn't become every bit as good as Van Dijk.

Now you've done such good work here, I'll just dump another name you can keep an eye out for and I'll go back and complete Netflix for a 2nd time.
Matchoi Djaló from Paços de Ferreira. 16 years old so he's only been handed the odd minutes a couple of times, and that was as a winger. He's doing some nice twisting and turning so might be another Modric/Frenkie de Jong in disguise. I don't think Paços de Ferreira could ask of too much for a player, so I wouldn't mind the gamble. But I guess Brexit means no player can join a British side until turning 18? Wow, that would even mean that Camavinga couldn't be signed until next December
 
Comment

Register to remove

Nice job

I think I watched the Inter game at the time, and I weren't really blown away. Doesn't matter, I still believe he'll become a star. The VVD comparison is a good one looking at their stature and genes. Van Dijk at Celtic was a good player, but he was still doing his best Foyth impression, stepping up in challenges misreading them. At the time I was surprised Southampton got the deal and no bigger team went in for him.

So with Five Five 's question about the Kabak appeal, it's no so much about what the guys aren't doing, but more a question about what they are already capable of doing at such a young age. I'll back Todibo because of his agility (I guess that's racist - reversed). If he can work on his leadership, I can't see why he couldn't become every bit as good as Van Dijk.

Now you've done such good work here, I'll just dump another name you can keep an eye out for and I'll go back and complete Netflix for a 2nd time.
Matchoi Djaló from Paços de Ferreira. 16 years old so he's only been handed the odd minutes a couple of times, and that was as a winger. He's doing some nice twisting and turning so might be another Modric/Frenkie de Jong in disguise. I don't think Paços de Ferreira could ask of too much for a player, so I wouldn't mind the gamble. But I guess Brexit means no player can join a British side until turning 18? Wow, that would even mean that Camavinga couldn't be signed until next December
Christ, I had to google the club, let alone the player. I watch virtually no Portuguese football, mainly European games, but will now see what I can find of him. How the fuck did you discover him?

Not sure Brexit changes much with regards to age we can recruit does it?

I wouldn't be averse to signing and then leaving Camavinga at Rennes for another year to be honest - but the way things are going, he'll be 18 before we start playing football again.
 
Comment

Register to remove

Christ, I had to google the club, let alone the player. I watch virtually no Portuguese football, mainly European games, but will now see what I can find of him. How the fuck did you discover him?

Not sure Brexit changes much with regards to age we can recruit does it?

I wouldn't be averse to signing and then leaving Camavinga at Rennes for another year to be honest - but the way things are going, he'll be 18 before we start playing football again.
I once watched a Portugal U17 match. He didn't stand out in particular, but he was on my radar from the off as he was representing this odd club. I liked him

Youtube aint of much help

 
Comment
Firstly I'll try this using the format of the original post (trying to be realistic too) although this obviously won't be possible in the summer and those valuations are likely to have slashed even more.
All using transfermarkt values / Values stated in first post of thread
SELLBUY
Vorm - £0m
Vertonghen - £0m
Gazzaniga - £5m
Aurier- £15m
Foyth - £15m
Dier - £25m
KWP - £10m
Lamela - £15m
Sissoko - £15m
Rose - £10m?
Onana - £30m
Dias - £40m
Eze - £10m
Camavinga - £40m
Giroud- £5m
Mukiele - £20m
Fergunson or Meunier -FREE
Buendia - £20m
Grimaldo - £30m
In addition to Promoting one of Austin or Whiteman to the 3rd Choice GK
SELL : £110M
BUY: £195M


Which Would leave a team looking like this
Lloris
Onana
Austin/Whiteman
Mukiele ----- Dias ----- Alderweireld----- Grimaldo
Meunier or Fergunson ------ Sanchez ---- Tanganga ---- Ben Davies

Lo Celso ------ Camavinga ------ Ndombele
Dele ----- Winks ------- Gedson

Bergwijn ------ Son
Moura ----- Buendia
Kane
Giroud

With Also Skipp , Eze and Sessegnon

HG = Skipp , Eze , Sessegnon , Kane , Dele , Tanganga , 3rd Choice GK , Maybe you'd look to buy Max Aarons at RB instead to fix that issue if that's not enough

Anyway just a bit of fun , But I'll post a more serious/realistic this summer thing if I was our D.O.F on a TINY budget.
 
Comment
Ok Now something realistic , Let's say hypothetically I have a £25m budget.
OUTSINS
Vorm and Vertonghen - FREE
Walker-Peters
Amos and Clarke (Loan)
Foyth
Danny Rose - £10m

TOTAL : £10m + £25m (£35m)
Hojberg - Walker-Peters(SWAP)+£5m
Giroud - £5m
Aarons - £15m
Eze - Amos , + Clarke-Loan (SWAP) + £5m
Todibo (SWAP) + £5m

Total : £35m
Or An alternative thing we could do instead of Swapping Foyth for Todibo is :
OUTSINS
Foyth - £15m
Lamela - £15m
Aurier - £10m

TOTAL = £40m (Net spent already spent on other signings)
Meunier - FREE
Willian or Ryan Fraser - FREE
Ruben Dias - £40m


TOTAL = £40m (Within spend)
That's what I would do as director of football and to be honest , this is nothing too outside of the box and people inside the club should be able to pull off something similar to this . We're able to improve in areas without spending much because we're being 'creative'

That would leave us with (below) as a squad , Homegrown are in green (where we are keeping to the HG rule) , I'll use the first example as that's more likely.
BTW : Formation would be a 4-3-3 going forward

GoalkeepersDefendersMidfieldersForwards
Lloris
Gazzaniga
Austin or Whiteman
Aarons
Aurier
Alderweireld
Sanchez
Todibo
Tanganga
Davies
Sessegnon
Dier
Skipp
Winks

Ndombele
Lo Celso
Gedson
Sissoko
Hojberg
Bergwijn
Lamela
Moura
Son
Eze
Dele
Kane

Giroud
 
Comment
Ok Now something realistic , Let's say hypothetically I have a £25m budget.
OUTSINS
Vorm and Vertonghen - FREE
Walker-Peters
Amos and Clarke (Loan)
Foyth
Danny Rose - £10m

TOTAL : £10m + £25m (£35m)
Hojberg - Walker-Peters(SWAP)+£5m
Giroud - £5m
Aarons - £15m
Eze - Amos , + Clarke-Loan (SWAP) + £5m
Todibo (SWAP) + £5m

Total : £35m
Or An alternative thing we could do instead of Swapping Foyth for Todibo is :
OUTSINS
Foyth - £15m
Lamela - £15m
Aurier - £10m

TOTAL = £40m (Net spent already spent on other signings)
Meunier - FREE
Willian or Ryan Fraser - FREE
Ruben Dias - £40m


TOTAL = £40m (Within spend)
That's what I would do as director of football and to be honest , this is nothing too outside of the box and people inside the club should be able to pull off something similar to this . We're able to improve in areas without spending much because we're being 'creative'

That would leave us with (below) as a squad , Homegrown are in green (where we are keeping to the HG rule) , I'll use the first example as that's more likely.
BTW : Formation would be a 4-3-3 going forward

GoalkeepersDefendersMidfieldersForwards
Lloris
Gazzaniga
Austin or Whiteman
Aarons
Aurier
Alderweireld
Sanchez
Todibo
Tanganga
Davies
Sessegnon
Dier
Skipp
Winks

Ndombele
Lo Celso
Gedson
Sissoko
Hojberg
Bergwijn
Lamela
Moura
Son
Eze
Dele
Kane

Giroud
I'd say we'd end up paying more than €5m with Kwp for hojbjerg. No way will we get €15m for Lamela and €15m for Foyth. Lucky to get it between them
 
Comment
I'd say we'd end up paying more than €5m with Kwp for hojbjerg. No way will we get €15m for Lamela and €15m for Foyth. Lucky to get it between them
There's definetly buyers for Foyth in either the French or Spanish leagues
Lamela idk . Maybe some Italian team will want him
 
Comment
There's definetly buyers for Foyth in either the French or Spanish leagues
Lamela idk . Maybe some Italian team will want him
What French team will have €15m to spend on Lamela. Seriously. Same for Italy. They will all be broke. Think your best bet with Lamela is part exchange for another player. Other wise it will be a sale for about €5m
 
Comment
What French team will have €15m to spend on Lamela. Seriously. Same for Italy. They will all be broke. Think your best bet with Lamela is part exchange for another player. Other wise it will be a sale for about €5m
Ok true Ligue 1 isn't a good example
But I could definetly see buyers for Foyth. Lamela on the other hand will be difficult to shun
 
Comment
Definitely, Hojbjerg is a £25m player, KWP £10m at most.
He only has a year left on his contract and by the time the season finishes it'll probably be only 10 months left . So his price could fall between 15-20 I would say. It all depends on how overall transfer fees pan out. Someone with only that little left on their contract could fall to €10m. Southampton cannot afford to lose him for nothing. Flip side of that is the price of players we want to sell will fall also
 
Comment
Hojberg has got 1 year left on his contract , plays for Southampton and factor in COVID
no way he's worth more than £15m now
He is their captian and has been a key player for the last couple of years while KWP hasn't proven anything so far in his career, at the very least we need to pay £10m if we swap those two players.
 
Last edited:
Comment

Register to remove

Top Bottom