The Dier of old was never mobile or dynamic enough to play CM.
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The Dier of old was never mobile or dynamic enough to play CM.
We've been back peddling for two and a half seasons. The last 12 months our performances and results fell off a cliff. Poch's selections have been a major part of that and he has been sacked.
I personally - and this isn't hind sight, it's on record - believe his selection of Dier in midfield was a major factor in us not being able to finish above Leicester and an inferior Woolwich in 15/16. But we're Spurs so we were all grateful just to be finishing 3rd and loving Dier because kicked some Chelsea players in the process of pissing away a 2-0 lead at Stamford Bridge.
Sissoko is tho....
(Why persist in arguing a point I'm not making? )
You made this point:
That's what I argued.
Fact is he was nowhere near this immobile and was one of our most regularly played players for years.
You're playing the athleticism card which again, given the context of my original post was NOT the point I was making.
Again you said "Mobility and energy levels never used to be his issue".
I think they were. I think they always have been. There has never been a time when they weren't IMO.
Either stand by your statement and disagree with me or agree with me but don't keep telling me I don't understand the context, it wasn't complicated.
I didn't say you didnt understand; you ain't stupid....
I just think you're using my comments as a platform to bash his abilities..... Your comments re: Poch's sacking and your abusing the timeframes involved back this theory up.
I'm comparing Dier A with Dier B and pondering what ought to be a reasonable length recovery process. Fair enough if you don't think I phrased my original post very well, but I stand staunchly by the fact that he never used to struggle like this.... Regardless of how much other trumped up baggage you care to pin on him.
You may have done that as well, but you also made a simple statement that I disagreed with about his prior mobility and energy levels.
And I stand staunchly by the fact that he was never mobile or dynamic enough, whether or not you choose to jettison some of your trumped up opinions of his footballing ability or athleticism is up to you.
I remember seeing stats about our centre midfield that season and it was actually when Mason or Bentaleb started that we dropped performance. Something like 2.2 points a game with Dier and Dembele, if either Mason or Bentaleb played we had a far lower average. Now, we all knew then and still know now that Dembele was the important player, but I still felt Dier was good. I am worried about Dier, I didn’t watch the Bayern match as I was at work, but I did feel he was improved and actually pretty good against a poor Burnley side. I won’t lose faith in him just yet, but an upgrade is almost certainly needed.
There was no "as well".... The sum point of my post was comparing scenario A to B.... You continue to neglect the context of my original post for your own ends.
I haven't brought my opinion on the player's ability into the equation tho, Blakey....
Then again Poch, Jose & Southgate all rated Dier circa 15-18..... Let the jury make of that what they will.
Every week I hope he gets a little better, a little fitter... But the injuries do seem to have taken their toll, but I still hold out hope
He was good.
He was good.
You were comparing scenario A with B, I disagreed with your assessment of scenario A.
If Poch, Southgate and Mourinho all rated Dier as a CM circa 15-18 then I disagree with them too.
But then Poch even said in his book he disagreed with Dier and saw his future as a CB. As early as 2016-17 he was picking Wanyama ahead of Dier as a CM and the jury can also consider that Mourinho also liked Marouan Fellani circa 15-18 and, lime Poch ended up getting the bullet.
So what you're saying is Dier has always been this immobile and that the last 12 months of disruption to his career via succession of illness and surgery aren't a factor.....?
I'm calling fake news.
Sorry AF but if you can say this then you gotta let me get away with 3 windows.
He had surgery in December and played a couple times in the spring IIRC. And was back at the beginning of preseason and the beginning of the year. Was he in the nations cup thingy?
Sorry AF but if you can say this then you gotta let me get away with 3 windows.
He was reported to have had some form of surgery this summer....
Eric Dier: ‘People said I was injured but I just kept on falling ill’
Tottenham’s Eric Dier tells David Hytner about the perforated appendix that laid him low for 11 months and left him in a downward spiral
www.google.co.uk
He's had some false dawn's inbetween illness and other niggles in the last year, but one way or another his last year or so has been screwed......
:townhmm:
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Can'tplayfootballitis and fulminant afraidoftheballosis are not real diseases though. But I'm with you in that we should give him another year to recover to full fitness and perhaps see how he does next year...and then make a decision. These 6 seasons he's been with us haven't been enough to determine anything. We wouldn't wanna be hasty.He was reported to have had some form of surgery this summer....
Eric Dier: ‘People said I was injured but I just kept on falling ill’
Tottenham’s Eric Dier tells David Hytner about the perforated appendix that laid him low for 11 months and left him in a downward spiral
He's had some false dawn's inbetween illness and other niggles in the last year, one way or another his last year or so has been screwed......
:townhmm:
BTW I have my suspicions that he was very high on the 'painful rebuild' list. He'd already been replaced once...and that was after his 'best' season with us. That said, I'd love for him to make it with us but I think there is ample evidence that unless he's Jose's Matic or he changes position that making bit might be difficult.
Can'tplayfootballitis and fulminant afraidoftheballosis are not real diseases though. But I'm with you in that we should give him another year to recover to full fitness and perhaps see how he does next year...and then make a decision. These 6 seasons he's been with us haven't been enough to determine anything. We wouldn't wanna be hasty.
BTW I have my suspicions that he was very high on the 'painful rebuild' list. He'd already been replaced once...and that was after his 'best' season with us. That said, I'd love for him to make it with us but I think there is ample evidence that unless he's Jose's Matic or he changes position that making bit might be difficult.
Like I already said to BC; your welcome to your own theories and rating of the player....
I'm responding to an earlier, rather hollow and un-insightful claim that "4 appearances should be more than enough for him to regain fitness".
We have a new manager, he'll assess the players and in time get rid of those he feels he has no need for..... Dier isn't my dream DM, but the rush to wade in with "X or Y is shit" is all a bit puerile tbh.... Especially when pushing fake news in order to foster a platform to do so.
EDIT Talking of puerile..... Morning MindNumb! Thanks for all your kisses, you sad fuck. What was it you said? "Get a life"...? An example to us all.
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He's like a midfield version of Titus Bramble.
Dier and Dembele played in midfield. Dele, Kane and Eriksen in the front 3.