Are the morals of our owners important to you?

[ShutUpPatrik]

It’s possible, but I think I’m right in saying that Joe (ENIC) can’t sell while in debt, Levy can of course, I’d start there….

Sport teams are sold in debt all the time so I wouldn't use our debt to say that it would stop a sale. It is a large debt but it is also tied up long term so the yearly outlay is not that bad for the type of people looking to buy teams.

But also as I said, I think that Spurs will be sold in chunks rather than in one go like how Newcastle and City got sold. So let's say that in five years when some of the debt is paid off, a new owner comes in and buys 20-30 % of the club. And just keeps buying more and more of the club as the years tick by. That seems the most likely scenario for me unless the new owners is a country. But ENIC seem to be targeting East Asia and the states with our sponsorships so I think it is more likely to be some sort of consortium.

 

[The Outsider]

They have also got us out of the CL and went one better out of the Europa, it's 3rd tier European football for us how is that for irrelevance

So your whole argument is based on just one season. Look at our European qualifying record before ENIC then try again about how irrelevant the improvement has been.

 

[The Outsider]

It’s possible, but I think I’m right in saying that Joe (ENIC) can’t sell while in debt, Levy can of course, I’d start there….

No you're entirely wrong ... nearly all businesses carry a level of debt you simply factor that into the price.

 

[COckneY Spurs]

Sport teams are sold in debt all the time so I wouldn't use our debt to say that it would stop a sale. It is a large debt but it is also tied up long term so the yearly outlay is not that bad for the type of people looking to buy teams.

But also as I said, I think that Spurs will be sold in chunks rather than in one go like how Newcastle and City got sold. So let's say that in five years when some of the debt is paid off, a new owner comes in and buys 20-30 % of the club. And just keeps buying more and more of the club as the years tick by. That seems the most likely scenario for me unless the new owners is a country. But ENIC seem to be targeting East Asia and the states with our sponsorships so I think it is more likely to be some sort of consortium.

I get what you’re saying, but I’m sure I read some financial thing where the debt has to be a percentage of value of assets, maybe why we continue to hear we are valued at 2bn plus….
Crazy that Newcastle could be bought for the cost of 2 Harry Kane’s, yet it would take that to buy 65% of our debt…..

Really don’t know what the future holds, but we need some kind of new direction how ever that comes about…

 

[skywalker68]

Yes we were big hitters in Europe

 

[Deuterz]

So your whole argument is based on just one season. Look at our European qualifying record before ENIC then try again about how irrelevant the improvement has been.

On a scale of 1-10 how confident are you that we'll be getting back in to the Europa League via the league this season.

 

[skywalker68]

On a scale of 1-10 how confident are you that we'll be getting back in to the Europa League via the league this season.

2

 

[Deuterz]

2

 

[skywalker68]

I can't see us getting Europe next season not with what we have but we remain hopeful.

 

[COckneY Spurs]

No you're entirely wrong ... nearly all businesses carry a level of debt you simply factor that into the price.

No I’m pretty sure I’m right in a round about way, you are right of course about companies can be sold with debt, but in our case it’s more complicated because they have borrowed the debt on the stadium not ENIC, even tho ENIC own the club.
The actual structure is the asset which secured the debt, so that’s why they separated all the infrastructure into a development company (can’t remember the name) to not have that liability on ENIC…I’m pretty sure THFC don’t own the stadium at this point, we are just tenants, who pay of the debt on behalf of the development company….
That development company is tied in a way to ENIC via investors, therefore it’s not just Levy and Lewis that are the boss, there are lots of investors behind the curtain we don’t see that indirectly have an interest in us….

It sounds like a mess….and there is a reason why Levy won’t be transparent with supporters….

 

[The Outsider]

On a scale of 1-10 how confident are you that we'll be getting back in to the Europa League via the league this season.

10 - I'm a supporter .... what about you?

 

[Deuterz]

10 - I'm a supporter .... what about you?

Yes, support is when you are irrational and decide your team is better than it is to look like a better fan.

Just shoo

 

[The Outsider]

No I’m pretty sure I’m right in a round about way, you are right of course about companies can be sold with debt, but in our case it’s more complicated because they have borrowed the debt on the stadium not ENIC, even tho ENIC own the club.
The actual structure is the asset which secured the debt, so that’s why they separated all the infrastructure into a development company (can’t remember the name) to not have that liability on ENIC…I’m pretty sure THFC don’t own the stadium at this point, we are just tenants, who pay of the debt on behalf of the development company….
That development company is tied in a way to ENIC via investors, therefore it’s not just Levy and Lewis that are the boss, there are lots of investors behind the curtain we don’t see that indirectly have an interest in us….

It sounds like a mess….and there is a reason why Levy won’t be transparent with supporters….

Nope you are misinformed ....

Tottenham Hotspur PLC is the holding company for the Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. This entirely stand alone company has raised funds, initially through loans but now converted into bonds, you are 100% wrong with your assertion that THFC don't own the stadium, of course THFC own the stadium indeed within the articles of THFC they are prevented from ever selling the stadium without a permanent replacement.

The only involvement ENIC have is via their ownership of shares in ENIC Sports and Development Holdings Limited, who own 85.55% of the shares in Tottenham Hotspur PLC.

You whole premise is thus completely wrong - but don't take my word for it it's all information readily available via Companies House.

As for "selling the club" of course that's not in truth how it works, ENIC can sell their shares and then shareholder control would change hands, THFC would however still remain an entirely stand alone company as it was before ENIC, and as it will be long after. It would just have different shareholders.

Hope that clears things up for you.

 

[The Outsider]

Yes, support is when you are irrational and decide your team is better than it is to look like a better fan.

So you won't answer your own question - are you a coward? or just embarrassed?

 

[Deuterz]

So you won't answer your own question - are you a coward? or just embarrassed?

Why would I do that when you gave some dumbass copout answer to a logical question? Are you incapable of taking off the rose tinted glasses for one second and making an honest appraisal of our chances?

But fine, either a three or a four. Not entirely impossible given Leicester's big drop off thus far, but still haven't seen nearly enough from us to be even slightly confident. Still look a team without clear identity or confidence.

 

[Shotgunofmichalebrow]

I am going to hold and break down this utter ludacris statement of yours. First of all who pays Rashfords living? My ex partner now adopted 3 kids, 2 when we were still togheter. I fought in 3 wars to make the world a better place for kids. So if your opinion is based on your own life, go out yourself and make a difference.

Is English your first language? I ask this genuinely because if it isn't it will shape my response.

Suffice to say I don't think you answer any of the substantive points. The status of your EX partner's children also is an irrelevance. But I'll point out with the same level of cynicism you view Rashford that lots of people adopt children for less than altruistic reasons. Also did YOU adopt these lucky kids?

I repeat with even more certainty Rashford has done way more than you or I. As for his wages who pays them? Who cares. He gave away 120 odd percent of them.

On a separate issue the frankly risible ideas about fighting geo political conflicts on other folks behalf...Well this may have held water in 1945, but at no time since: not Vietnam certainly not in the Wests misadventures in the middle East. Also as a man from a military family, I'm frankly supprised you would attempt to hide behind that in such a base way( maybe the first language issue?) talking like this is usually the last thing vets do. You should also know as well as I do that men join the service for a myriad of complicated reasons. I have no more faith in what motivated your enlistment than you have in Rashfords sincerity

 

[Fazz]

Show me a post where I have defended Joe Lewis in any way. All I have said is that nothing he is alleged to have done compares with what the Saudi regime have done.

I find it staggering to be honest that in order to defend the Saudi take over of Newcastle people have turned to extreme whataboutery. Saying Lewis, ENIC, the Tories, the government and eating bacon are just as bad.

I don't see pointing out of the crimes of our owner as whataboutery, or a defense of the Saudis.

The Saudi regimes are criminals - their actions in Yemen alone show that. If people want to point out our man supports criminal endeavours too, it is a fair point. It doesn't defend the Saudis but it makes the point that we aren't exactly angelic ourselves.

 

[Fazz]

I am going to hold and break down this utter ludacris statement of yours. First of all who pays Rashfords living? My ex partner now adopted 3 kids, 2 when we were still togheter. I fought in 3 wars to make the world a better place for kids. So if your opinion is based on your own life, go out yourself and make a difference.

Which 3 wars did you fight in?

 

[John Thomas]

So you won't answer your own question - are you a coward? or just embarrassed?

You haven't answered my two questions yet

Are you ashamed that our owner is 4th on the list of most immoral, henious owners, with only Newcastle, City and Chelsea's above.

And given your statement that a true fan should always support the whole club, not just the bits they like, would you still be supporting Spurs if WE had been taken over by the Saudi's.


You can keep running away if you like. But calling another poster a coward?

 

[NorseYid]

Yes, support is when you are irrational and decide your team is better than it is to look like a better fan.

Just shoo

Not just better.

tHe bEsTeSt !!!!!