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Management Financial Results - Year Ended 30 June 2023

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manmountainbutters said:
It's really triggered you hasn't it !!!!??

Please do inform us then of the metrics behind Levy's £3m bonus, which is quite generous as a multiple of base. Are you suggesting it is ok in the context of the dire on-field performance in 2023?
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You're the one writing a load of paragraphs, not me - seems like you're triggered over mere baseless accusations just because it fits your confirmation bias, the only thing is that you've made up this story because you have a clear agenda, it probably sounds good in your head though.

Those bonuses are to do with financial performance (literally every CEO in every company will get a bonus for hitting financial targets), you're arguing that he should only get a bonus if the team performs i.e winning trophies, so how do you know that he doesn't have a trophy bonus as well, or are you suggesting that he shouldn't get a bonus if the club hit financial targets?
 
Shadydan said:
You're the one writing a load of paragraphs, not me - seems like you're triggered over mere baseless accusations just because it fits your confirmation bias, the only thing is that you've made up this story because you have a clear agenda, it probably sounds good in your head though.

Those bonuses are to do with financial performance (literally every CEO in every company will get a bonus for hitting financial targets), you're arguing that he should only get a bonus if the team performs i.e winning trophies, so how do you know that he doesn't have a trophy bonus as well, or are you suggesting that he shouldn't get a bonus if the club hit financial targets?
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Yes, I'm arguing all of what you say... unless you actually care to read what I've posted.

My "agenda" is to question a bonus close to 100% of base salary - which is a big bonus by UK CEO standards - when the team has been so shite. There is no agenda to that. Do Tottenham publish the mechanism by which his bonus is derived ?
 
TheSpurEst said:
Well... you see...

Profit =/= money.

You build 1,5 bn EUR stadium.
You amortize it fully with 25 years.
Yearly amortization 60 mEUR.
It is not money going out, it is accounting calculation.

Same goes for players. For example Kane - brought him up from academy, only incurred running costs (not capitalized) = his sale is 100% profit, so in this instance money=profit. But if we sign Rodon for 10 mil, have amortized his balance sheet value to maybe 6 mEUR but sell him to Leeds in summer for 16 mEUR, then we get in 16 mEUR of MONEY but make 10 mEUR of PROFIT.
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Sounds bad, losing thst much but it’s just on paper . Results say stadium amortisation is 72m pounds.
Ndombele costing us 9m every year in amortisation and never plays for us.
 
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manmountainbutters said:
But a football club IS different to purely commercial organisations
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Do you believe that Joe Lewis sees it that way??
No offense but this is incredibly naive.
Danny’s salary should be tied to football performance because (and only because) our revenue should be tied to football performance. In truth and in fairness, it is to a degree particularly in European qualification. But Danny has done the near impossible in essentially decoupling our revenue from our onfield performance. It’s brilliant.
And all dues to the nobs at the FA who have devalued the FA Cup so that it’s worth a fraction of getting into the Europa League who have helped him in that pursuit.

Put it this way, if you own a restaurant, would you pay the restaurant manager for breaking even and winning an award or making you gobs of money?

As for a football regulator, just another joker. Is he going to insist that our wage to revenue ratio be pushed up from 50% to 60% to put more money on the field when they allow a bunch of head-choppers to buy a club?
 

manmountainbutters said:
But a football club IS different to purely commercial organisations. The ultimate aim of the club is not to make money, that is a means to the ultimate aim, which is to provide entertainment and success onfield. Financial success should of course be an important element in Levy's bonus. So should footballing success.

No doubt "shadydan" will be along soon to decry this as "more speculation" on my part.

But I think supporting a club is somewhat different to choosing which brand of washing tabs to buy.

And FWIW that distinction is recognised officially by HMG also - hence the football regulator being established.
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My take on the argument are we a football club or a business? Whilst the HMRC can wind up clubs and clubs that default go to the bottom of a pyramid, then yes we are a business first. We cannot exist unless we act as a business. Football is always secondary unfortunately.

I don't think the regulator is going to protect clubs and their fans from the actions of feckless owners so I don't think anything will change.

I'm convinced that the government only saved Chelsea with its "special license" due to the fact the Tory party were deeply unpopular at the time and Chelsea have a lot of Tory voters. I don't think clubs will be given any more special protections in future.
 
NotThatTedHughes said:
Do you believe that Joe Lewis sees it that way??
No offense but this is incredibly naive.
Danny’s salary should be tied to football performance because (and only because) our revenue should be tied to football performance. In truth and in fairness, it is to a degree particularly in European qualification. But Danny has done the near impossible in essentially decoupling our revenue from our onfield performance. It’s brilliant.
And all dues to the nobs at the FA who have devalued the FA Cup so that it’s worth a fraction of getting into the Europa League who have helped him in that pursuit.

Put it this way, if you own a restaurant, would you pay the restaurant manager for breaking even and winning an award or making you gobs of money?

As for a football regulator, just another joker. Is he going to insist that our wage to revenue ratio be pushed up from 50% to 60% to put more money on the field when they allow a bunch of head-choppers to buy a club?
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No idea if Lewis sees it that way - don't want to get called out for yet more "speculation" by "shady dan" !

If Levy should only be rewarded on financial success, why would there be any football component to that (I appreciate the link between the two), but surely you'd just reward him on financial metrics?

The points you make are all fair observations, and at the heart of it is the fact that a football club isn't like any other business, though there are some people / business models, that attempt to treat it as any other business, and as you say, financially Levy has made a huge success in that approach.

We're talking here about how we think the club should be run, including remuneration of Directors. My point is that onfield success, as well as financial success, should be direct inputs to their comp. Maybe we'd have a better team if they were?
 
Stopped worrying about Levys salary yrs ago, he can do what he wants and does what he wants. He does it because he can get away with it, despite poor on field performances, his off field performances are generally good. He can put the OAP prices up and get away with it, because our level of protesting the likes of same are mediocre at best. The amount he takes is minimal compared to the likes of the Glaziers, once he backs Ange in the next few windows and not sells us short again then he might even start on a road to redemption and I say that as someone who is far from his biggest fan.
 
manmountainbutters said:
We're talking here about how we think the club should be run, including remuneration of Directors. My point is that onfield success, as well as financial success, should be direct inputs to their comp. Maybe we'd have a better team if they were?
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I don’t disagree with you BUT you are looking at things entirely from a supporter’s perspective. Someone with no financial stake in the club at all.

Getting into territory that got me banned from SC:

I suspect that if you had eight or more digits tied up in a Premier League club and it was your primary investment , you might feel a little differently.

The perspective I’ve tried to offer here isn’t a defense of our owners. They can be infuriating. It’s based on my personal interactions with US sports owners essentially in the same position. I would love our owners to subsidize on-field success but I’m resigned to the fact that Lewis sees Spurs differently to me and I no longer rail against it or lose sleep over it.
 
manmountainbutters said:
But a football club IS different to purely commercial organisations. The ultimate aim of the club is not to make money, that is a means to the ultimate aim, which is to provide entertainment and success onfield. Financial success should of course be an important element in Levy's bonus. So should footballing success.

No doubt "shadydan" will be along soon to decry this as "more speculation" on my part.

But I think supporting a club is somewhat different to choosing which brand of washing tabs to buy.

And FWIW that distinction is recognised officially by HMG also - hence the football regulator being established.
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I'm pretty much with you on the bonus part, but as I don't know what they are in relation to, I can't really comment.

The ultimate aim of any CEO in any organisation is profit and growth. Yes the Football side should definitely be factored in, but who's to say it wasn't? He's still overseen a great deal of growth in the club, and he should most definitely be looking to increase our revenue streams and profits, as it's been proven umpteen times that every penny of profit goes back into the club. For all we know, his bonus could have been bigger had we got CL or a trophy.
 
Ionman34 said:
I'm pretty much with you on the bonus part, but as I don't know what they are in relation to, I can't really comment.

The ultimate aim of any CEO in any organisation is profit and growth. Yes the Football side should definitely be factored in, but who's to say it wasn't? He's still overseen a great deal of growth in the club, and he should most definitely be looking to increase our revenue streams and profits, as it's been proven umpteen times that every penny of profit goes back into the club. For all we know, his bonus could have been bigger had we got CL or a trophy.
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If the majority shares in the club are sold (Joe Lewis) I hope our new owner is more engaged and makes Levy’s bonus related to actual football success ( and I am not referring just just top 4), the club is built up enough at the infrastructure level, it’s time to move on.
 
Shadydan said:
You're the one writing a load of paragraphs, not me - seems like you're triggered over mere baseless accusations just because it fits your confirmation bias, the only thing is that you've made up this story because you have a clear agenda, it probably sounds good in your head though.

Those bonuses are to do with financial performance (literally every CEO in every company will get a bonus for hitting financial targets), you're arguing that he should only get a bonus if the team performs i.e winning trophies, so how do you know that he doesn't have a trophy bonus as well, or are you suggesting that he shouldn't get a bonus if the club hit financial targets?
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The CEO gifting himself a £3 million bonus for hitting financial targets that he set himself? Makes sense.
 
Shadydan said:
Of course it does, have you were worked for a company before, everyone get's a bonus if they hit certain incentives, the CEO naturally gets the highest bonus because he's at the top of the tree :confused:
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I said...makes sense. Its obvious that he'd do that when he can.

And in your case he can certainly do what he wants and you'll be happy.

This is a football club first and foremost to most spurs fans before its a company though. Be nice to have owners who felt the same.
 
Kane you believe it said:
I said...makes sense. Its obvious that he'd do that when he can.

And in your case he can certainly do what he wants and you'll be happy.

This is a football club first and foremost to most spurs fans before its a company though. Be nice to have owners who felt the same.
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Sorry thought you were being sarcastic 😆

Not really about me being 'happy', I'm overly content with the way he's running the club though.

You're right but you're speaking from a fan perspective not an owner POV, guess we just need to accept that football is a business nowadays.
 
Kane you believe it said:
I said...makes sense. Its obvious that he'd do that when he can.

And in your case he can certainly do what he wants and you'll be happy.

This is a football club first and foremost to most spurs fans before its a company though. Be nice to have owners who felt the same.
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We'd be in receivership if we did, or under investigation for dodgy dealing.

It amazes me that there's still this desire for an Abramovic, when we have clear evidence in front of us just what type of damage that type of owner does to a club.
 
Ionman34 said:
We'd be in receivership if we did, or under investigation for dodgy dealing.

It amazes me that there's still this desire for an Abramovic, when we have clear evidence in front of us just what type of damage that type of owner does to a club.
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What damage? They've won everything, their fans have seen some of the best players ever to grace the premier league and they currently sit in touching distance of 8th.

Didn't we finish 8th last year?
 
Kane you believe it said:
What damage? They've won everything, their fans have seen some of the best players ever to grace the premier league and they currently sit in touching distance of 8th.

Didn't we finish 8th last year?
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Are you serious?

If they're found guilty of even half of what they've been accused of, they run a very real risk of being decimated.

Then there's a high probability of them being stripped of their titles and other honours, both European and domestic.

Would you trade your future for that?
 
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