Management Levy / €NIC. In or Out

[scott]

It’s kind of sad that Tottenham are constantly ridiculed while they've been one of the few clubs to build their success via the old fashioned way by managing the bottom line. Yes they've come up small via those big occasions with a trophy on the line which obviously has magnified things . I mean they ultimately win the 2015 Prem season via the top6 and this is the one year Leicester City has that fantastic run...Unreal. Either way, just the general direction of English and European football simply is about oil and teams spending outrageous money to ultimately purchase success. And what you have is a few Haves and many Have Nots where the competitive balance is not pretty on the eyes. In the end, I'd rather have ENIC than some Middle East sovereign buying success. Proper English club for me.

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I really don't get the stigma about oil. No company with the money to buy Tottenham for £3-4 billion is going to be morally good.

Samsung and Apple source their phone batteries from lithium mines using child labour, but you wouldn't complain if they bought us. The only person in the world who could buy Tottenham and claim to be somewhat moral is probably Bill Gates.

Clubs either get bought by oil barons who want a new toy, investment companies that want to turn a profit or sport moguls who want global collaboration between their brands. All of these groups would happily join a European Super League, betray our history and sell local fans down the drain without a second thought - which they tried to do in 2021, including Levy.

Bad people exist whether they invest in Tottenham or not. If I had the choice of being a successful club under a rich, evil bastard or an unsuccessful club under a rich, evil bastard then I'm choosing success - whether that money comes from oil (Dubai), quasi-slave run warehouses (Amazon) or knowing how hairy my arse crack is so they can market to me (Google), I really don't care.

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I know I have mentioned it a few times but it is odd how many people support & fund little black African kids dying in mines that collapse on them, as they believe their right to a smart phone is more important. Yet supporting a football club owned by oil regime is not ok.

 

[scott]

Yeah I’m not averse to a bit of change and would love to see us win the league or champions league a lot more than I want to see us win the Audi or carabao cup. I just don’t see ENIC as the “bad guys”. They are business guys. Football is a massive business these days. Footballers wages are mental.

And I’m 100% of the belief the ESL will happen one day.
Especially if more American owners get involved in the ownership of premier league clubs.

Then the question is - is it better to be competing in that or trying to win the Premier League “lite” with Everton, Fulham and West Ham?

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Hmmm that’s a tough one. Either get left behind in the premier league but we have a good chance of winning it. Or join the big boys in a super league but struggle on the pitch. Personally I would rather we say no to a super league as that’s the height of football being about greed! We can take the moral high ground too ha

 

[WillWilliams]

Hmmm that’s a tough one. Either get left behind in the premier league but we have a good chance of winning it. Or join the big boys in a super league but struggle on the pitch. Personally I would rather we say no to a super league as that’s the height of football being about greed! We can take the moral high ground too ha

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#doingittherightway

 

[skywalker68]

Hmmm that’s a tough one. Either get left behind in the premier league but we have a good chance of winning it. Or join the big boys in a super league but struggle on the pitch. Personally I would rather we say no to a super league as that’s the height of football being about greed! We can take the moral high ground too ha

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A ESL would see us as the whipping boys anyway, which is probably why the other clubs were happy enough for us to join.

 

[daveyboy88]

Yeah I’m not averse to a bit of change and would love to see us win the league or champions league a lot more than I want to see us win the Audi or carabao cup. I just don’t see ENIC as the “bad guys”. They are business guys. Football is a massive business these days. Footballers wages are mental.

And I’m 100% of the belief the ESL will happen one day.
Especially if more American owners get involved in the ownership of premier league clubs.

Then the question is - is it better to be competing in that or trying to win the Premier League “lite” with Everton, Fulham and West Ham?

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if fifa can block players playing in the ESL from playing in world cups/ internationals etc etc. then once youre in the ESL youre stuck and cant come back to normal football, so even shorter career. if clubs outside the ESL refuse to sell players to ESL then the standard wont be that great after the first few years anyway. if fifa really want to they can stop it. or it will happen and after a few years will turn proper shit and they will all want to go back to what they had. all it takes is clubs outside the ESL to refuse to do business with clubs in it and its fucked after a few years.

 

[WillWilliams]

if fifa can block players playing in the ESL from playing in world cups/ internationals etc etc. then once youre in the ESL youre stuck and cant come back to normal football, so even shorter career. if clubs outside the ESL refuse to sell players to ESL then the standard wont be that great after the first few years anyway. if fifa really want to they can stop it. or it will happen and after a few years will turn proper shit and they will all want to go back to what they had. all it takes is clubs outside the ESL to refuse to do business with clubs in it and its fucked after a few years.

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Money talks.

When you have clubs worth billions and able to pay the wages it will come. Take the best international players out of the World Cup. Will it still have the same appeal.
Change will happen. Just the evolution of the game.

 

[AberdeenYid]

They don’t mind when it’s personal attacks on levy/enic out posters.

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Goes on with “both sides”. Levy Out are as complicit in this as those who don’t want that or care.

To give you and your closest pal your due though, you are both very good at seemingly avoiding personal attacks on singular posters. You go down the passive aggressive method of attacking a perceived group of people instead. Talking “odd behaviour”, “such a shame”, “hey if you are happy being mediocre”, “I support the team but if you want to support Levy instead, that’s great”, etc. Maybe some on here don’t see your game, but I do. At least the personal attackers aren’t hiding their true intentions behind niceties like you always do.

What I find truly odd (to use one of your favourites) is that you can’t understand the position of those who don’t think we need change. I get why you want the board gone and the club sold. I don’t agree, but understand. You and a few others on here can’t even seem to grasp the concept that not everyone agrees with you. Maybe wander down the road halfway and meet some folk that just want the club to be successful like you do. Instead of calling them “odd” and “strange”.

 

[JimothyCF14]

Another one pretending to be neutral yet constantly attacking enic out posters & defending enic in posters. They always seem ashamed for some reason.

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Absolute bollocks. I'm neither ENIC in or out, I just accept ranting on a message board won't bring about some oil sheikh buying the club. I live in reality.

But you carry on making shit up.

 

[stevee]

Goes on with “both sides”. Levy Out are as complicit in this as those who don’t want that or care.

To give you and your closest pal your due though, you are both very good at seemingly avoiding personal attacks on singular posters. You go down the passive aggressive method of attacking a perceived group of people instead. Talking “odd behaviour”, “such a shame”, “hey if you are happy being mediocre”, “I support the team but if you want to support Levy instead, that’s great”, etc. Maybe some on here don’t see your game, but I do. At least the personal attackers aren’t hiding their true intentions behind niceties like you always do.

What I find truly odd (to use one of your favourites) is that you can’t understand the position of those who don’t think we need change. I get why you want the board gone and the club sold. I don’t agree, but understand. You and a few others on here can’t even seem to grasp the concept that not everyone agrees with you. Maybe wander down the road halfway and meet some folk that just want the club to be successful like you do. Instead of calling them “odd” and “strange”.

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[Tottenham Massive]

I really don't get the stigma about oil. No company with the money to buy Tottenham for £3-4 billion is going to be morally good.

Samsung and Apple source their phone batteries from lithium mines using child labour, but you wouldn't complain if they bought us. The only person in the world who could buy Tottenham and claim to be somewhat moral is probably Bill Gates.

Clubs either get bought by oil barons who want a new toy, investment companies that want to turn a profit or sport moguls who want global collaboration between their brands. All of these groups would happily join a European Super League, betray our history and sell local fans down the drain without a second thought - which they tried to do in 2021, including Levy.

Bad people exist whether they invest in Tottenham or not. If I had the choice of being a successful club under a rich, evil bastard or an unsuccessful club under a rich, evil bastard then I'm choosing success - whether that money comes from oil (Dubai), quasi-slave run warehouses (Amazon) or knowing how hairy my arse crack is so they can market to me (Google), I really don't care.

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A very, sensible, honest post and riposte to the hypocritical moral do-gooders clogging up this forum.
I know a bunch of Newcastle fans and every one of them is excited by the prospect of imminent success around the corner.
Every City fan I've ever known would never swap Sheikh Mansour for Lewis and Levy.

And yet, the general consensus on here is that most would turn their back on the club if we were subjected to a similar takeover.
As if somehow Spurs are a uniqulely different breed to every other fan base.

It comes down, I think, to varying degrees of hypocrisy, jealousy, self denial, or a last ditch weapon to use in defense of our own shortcomings under ENIC

 

[Ionman34]

Money talks.

When you have clubs worth billions and able to pay the wages it will come. Take the best international players out of the World Cup. Will it still have the same appeal.
Change will happen. Just the evolution of the game.

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I have to agree. When the ESL was first mentioned, I was talking about it to mt Brother. We both agreed that, whilst it might not happen straight away, it was inevitable, it's the evolution of the game, particularly with the amount of money that is still relatively untapped.

I'm absolutely against it, but I really can't see that it won't happen eventually.

The PL is the most watched league on Earth, with the highest proportion of fans across the globe tuning into it. The vast majority of those fans follow a finite amount of clubs because said clubs are awash with money. If those clubs seceded to a European league, that legion of fans will follow them. They won't care about the national leagues that are poorer as a result, because they're only interested in the stars they can attract and the reflected glory they can bask in.

Let's face it, the vast majority of those fans abroad don't follow City because they have historical ties with the club, they'll likely have been totally unaware of them until Mansour rocked up and they brought in some of the World's best players. They follow the likes of Utd, Liverpool and Woolwich because they were either successful in the PL or CL.

Glory hunters will go where the glory is, and that won't be in domestic leagues that will have been downgraded as a result.

It's an unpleasant reality of the capitalist society we live in. I absolutely hate it, but I'm not deluded enough to deny it. Domestic fans no longer matter, we're just the background noise that adds to the spectacle. We'll voice our displeasure, we'll be ignored, then we'll accept it because we will largely have no choice and no say. Corporate wants and Worldwide glory hunters will see to that.

Evolution isn't always a good thing, but evolution is inevitable.

 

[Ionman34]

Goes on with “both sides”. Levy Out are as complicit in this as those who don’t want that or care.

To give you and your closest pal your due though, you are both very good at seemingly avoiding personal attacks on singular posters. You go down the passive aggressive method of attacking a perceived group of people instead. Talking “odd behaviour”, “such a shame”, “hey if you are happy being mediocre”, “I support the team but if you want to support Levy instead, that’s great”, etc. Maybe some on here don’t see your game, but I do. At least the personal attackers aren’t hiding their true intentions behind niceties like you always do.

What I find truly odd (to use one of your favourites) is that you can’t understand the position of those who don’t think we need change. I get why you want the board gone and the club sold. I don’t agree, but understand. You and a few others on here can’t even seem to grasp the concept that not everyone agrees with you. Maybe wander down the road halfway and meet some folk that just want the club to be successful like you do. Instead of calling them “odd” and “strange”.

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Great post.

Unfortunately, the only people that will take it on board are those that are already of that mindset.

 

[Ionman34]

A very, sensible, honest post and riposte to the hypocritical moral do-gooders clogging up this forum.
I know a bunch of Newcastle fans and every one of them is excited by the prospect of imminent success around the corner.
Every City fan I've ever known would never swap Sheikh Mansour for Lewis and Levy.

And yet, the general consensus on here is that most would turn their back on the club if we were subjected to a similar takeover.
As if somehow Spurs are a uniqulely different breed to every other fan base.

It comes down, I think, to varying degrees of hypocrisy, jealousy, self denial, or a last ditch weapon to use in defense of our own shortcomings under ENIC

Click to shrink...

 

[SpursRomania]

The only person in the world who could buy Tottenham and claim to be somewhat moral is probably Bill Gates.

Click to shrink...

 

[AberdeenYid]

And yet, the general consensus on here is that most would turn their back on the club if we were subjected to a similar takeover.
As if somehow Spurs are a uniqulely different breed to every other fan base.

It comes down, I think, to varying degrees of hypocrisy, jealousy, self denial, or a last ditch weapon to use in defense of our own shortcomings under ENIC

Click to shrink...

I thought the general consensus on here was that ENIC should sell? 85% so the last time you were crowing about it. So those 85% want ENIC to sell but not to anyone naughty? Otherwise they’d turn their back on the club?

That’s the general consensus is it?

Or are you so used to making shit up that you just don’t notice you are doing it anymore?

Nice last paragraph by the way. No personal attacks, just a massive generalization of a group that hardly exists. Speak about last ditch weapons. You used to be better at this than you are now. Sad to see the decline.

 

[Carl Johnson]

I really don't get the stigma about oil. No company with the money to buy Tottenham for £3-4 billion is going to be morally good.

Samsung and Apple source their phone batteries from lithium mines using child labour, but you wouldn't complain if they bought us. The only person in the world who could buy Tottenham and claim to be somewhat moral is probably Bill Gates.

Clubs either get bought by oil barons who want a new toy, investment companies that want to turn a profit or sport moguls who want global collaboration between their brands. All of these groups would happily join a European Super League, betray our history and sell local fans down the drain without a second thought - which they tried to do in 2021, including Levy.

Bad people exist whether they invest in Tottenham or not. If I had the choice of being a successful club under a rich, evil bastard or an unsuccessful club under a rich, evil bastard then I'm choosing success - whether that money comes from oil (Dubai), quasi-slave run warehouses (Amazon) or knowing how hairy my arse crack is so they can market to me (Google), I really don't care.

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There are no moral/ethical billionaires on this earth

Bill Gates is probably the worst among those you mentioned above.

Ever heard of Monsanto and their recent activities in Africa?

 

[LeParisien]

I am surprised by those arguing for dirty money coming into our club, particularly by people who seem to be fighting for the soul of our great club. Those who look at the soulless eithad (that they still can’t fill despite all their success) and think « that’s a proper club! ».

But the biggest surprise is the people desperate not to see the difference between Apple on the one hand, and a country that kidnaps and murders journalists, oppresses women, finances religious extremism across the Middle East, and sexually assaults and tortures prisoners on the other.

Are you for fucking real?

This is even more bizarre than the poster who couldn’t see the privilege that spurs had via a vis 90% of the football league.

 

[The Mercurial No.10]

83% want ENIC out ? Careful what you wish for really. And if you want an oil sovereign to come to the rescue, you've sadly lost the plot really.

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Stick to Basketball.

 

[iz futbal]

I am surprised by those arguing for dirty money coming into our club, particularly by people who seem to be fighting for the soul of our great club. Those who look at the soulless eithad (that they still can’t fill despite all their success) and think « that’s a proper club! ».

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Near 2007, mancity's average attendance was around 42000. Now their attendances in the PL are near 53000 almost near their capacity. Their stadium does look full almost every game.

 

[The Mercurial No.10]

Would appreciate if someone could let me know what % of Joe Lewis's money (that we've seen very little fucking of) is clean and what % is dirty so I can take the most virtuous moral stance.

Also Google 'Joe Lewis Patagonia' and maybe translate a few things to English while you're at it.