The Y Word

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Every single one of my Jewish spurs mates fully supports it (non spurs ones as well) and has expressed how connected it makes them feel to the club.
I know 2 Jewish West ham fans(they don't know each other).I asked one did it bother him, he said no,not at all. i asked the other one,he said "yes! I'm jealous ,i wish we were known as the yids"

Now i know they don't speak for all non Spurs supporting Jewish people, but it's an opinion some of them have.
 
Being very honest l have felt more unattached to the term over recent years .
Maybe my dislike of our present unambitious owners and Sugar before have unfairly Tainted my enthusiasm for it .
I rarely use it and do not culturally identify with it but it is in my opinion up to our Jewish support to decide if it should be used , not us gentiles .
 
I think it would possibly be the end of the road for me. Not because i am particularly attached to the Y word (although I do like it) but because I am sick and tired of being fucking dictated to by the politically correct.
 
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At the 91"semi final 4 of us took an Israeli flag but none of us were Jewish.
Why looking back , maybe because we knew it wound up the Woolwich support more than anything else , does this make it right , l don't know ?
 
I think it would possibly be the end of the road for me. Not because i am particularly attached to the Y word (although I do like it) but because I am sick and tired of being fucking dictated to be the politically correct.
So what you're saying is it's ok to be racist?

TFC Control seem to be slow on the uptake so thought I get in first.
 
I'd love to hear more of your thoughts on this.

Regards.

I have Jewish Grandparents on both Sides but I suppose I look about as Jewish as David Baddiel. My name is Jewish and have been to games with Hasidic Friends, I personally have only felt racially offended when I hear other fans chanting. about gas chambers. It makes me think of some of my ancestors lost in the war. I know that their intention is to make me angry or upset, I don't give them that honour. I've seen fans arrested for it which is a good thing in my opinion. As I've said on here many times, I consider the vast majority of racism to be a form of bullying. The bully tries to get under someones skin by exploiting a minority characteristic or using taboo language. In most cases, if it wasn't race they'd just go for the next best thing. My contribution to that is not to be a bully myself, and not to feed them by giving them what they want. Someone like Baddiel (who is a driving force in this debate) fails miserably on both counts.
 
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Not this fucking nonsense again.

I’ve literally never met a British Jew who had a problem with it, and that includes the former chief rabbi the late lord Sachs.

Please I wish a steward or someone tries to caution me when I will finally be able to fly to a match again for singing it, I’ll drop the trousers and smack him with my circumcised prick so hard he’ll mutter “Yiddo yiddo”
 
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Not this fucking nonsense again.

I’ve literally never met a British Jew who had a problem with it, and that includes the former chief rabbi the late lord Sachs.

Please I wish a steward or someone tries to caution me when I will finally be able to fly to a match again for singing it, I’ll drop the trousers and smack him with my circumcised prick so hard he’ll mutter “Yiddo yiddo”

That would create an interesting scene in front of police and stewards.

A gentile telling a jew, what he can and cannot call himself?

I'd love to see the Met and the CPS wiggle their way out of that one.
 
I was on the tube with Chelsea fans on the way to LC semi final. Songs about hanging me, fucking dead bodies etc. They also chanted "we can't say the y word" then hissed.

Removing the y word from us would only be a win for them and would allow them free reign to dish out antisemitism in blatant and subtle ways.

Every single one of my Jewish spurs mates fully supports it (non spurs ones as well) and has expressed how connected it makes them feel to the club. am I supposed to discount that?
Two songs to consider:

"The thing I love most, is being a Yid!"

and...

"Spurs, are on their way to Auschwitz.... Hitler's gonna gas 'em again!"

One contains the dreaded 'Y-word', one doesn't....

You tell me which is more offensive?

Case closed m'lud!
 
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Without getting into whether the y word should be used, I hate it when words were acceptable in the past but then are deemed unacceptable. I read today that they are cutting some of Dads Army scenes as they are no longer deemed suitable. They were when it was made and that should be good enough. What will broadcasters do if showing previous Spurs matches? cut any singing of the y word? Strangely the F word seems much more acceptable than in previous years.
How can the crown prosecution service decide that last year it was acceptable to use the y word but not this year? Was a new law passed?
 
Excuse the long-read reply, but this was my questionnaire response I sent into the club a few years back when asked about fans' thoughts on the subject...

*THE YID DEBATE*

My honest opinion is that I think the TRUE origins of the word have been either lost, forgotten, or ignored by modern Society...

Yid was never originally an offensive word, it really wasn't!

"Reb Yid" was a term that means/meant 'Friend or mate' when said by someone Jewish to someone else Jewish, who may not know the other one's name...

..."a nice YIDDESHE boy/girl" was a phrase I used to hear MY Grandparents and older Jewish relatives use regularly when growing up.

I am Jewish, I have heard the word and versions of the word used (within my own family) with only positive connotations in the past...

but yes, I am well aware, and understand that the latter-day use of the word has been taken fom it's original meaning, and warped into something wholly unsavoury by those who choose to abuse Jews.

But let's face it, those same people can still vent anti-Semitic feelings (be it at Spurs fans, or Jews in the street) by hissing at us like a Gas chamber, or 'Seig Heilling' or by calling someone a 'dirty Jew'... all of which are arguably more offensive, yet miraculously don't contain the word 'Yid'.

You only have to look at the true Indian origins and PEACEFUL MEANING of the Swastika to see how a symbol or a word can be turned into something unsavoury and offensive, by those wanting to warp something originally good into something that represents pure evil.

It is no more the job of Indian or Eurasian religions to 'reclaim' the Swastika symbol as their own, than it should be for Jews to reclaim the word YID.
but I know that Indian cultures STILL use the Swastika as a symbol of peace... and why wouldn't they? It's THEIR symbol!

The same as the word Yid belonged to Jews in the first place, and we were using it just fine before the anti-Semites and racists came along.

If you want to eradicate anti-Semitism and racism, focus on the anti-Semites and racists perhaps!

It's always been about context.

In a football context, (and as a Jewish Spurs fan) I don't see anything wrong with non-Jewish Spurs fans standing alongside Jewish ones, who are prepared to identify with a racial/religious minority by using the word in solidarity and representing togetherness, regardless of race, colour or creed (in keeping with its origins.)

By using it in a positive context for long enough, then maybe one day, its darker historical meaning will start to be eroded and diluted, and who knows, it might even return to it's positive roots as meaning 'mate' or 'friend'?

I know it's a minefield, and a real can of worms that one questionnaire can't really solve... and I get that people who ARE offended by it, have maybe only ever heard it in a negative sense.

But surely it's the job of modern society to turn past negatives into positives, by choosing NOT to bow to small minded bigots who decided that a perfectly decent word was to be redefined, forcing future generations to work out how to change it back.

Eradicating the word from modern day usage won't stop anti-Semitism, (they'll still hate Jews, whether Spurs fans use the word YID or not) you can't stop them THINKING it!

All it will do is merely 'cryogenically' suspend that words' negative meaning forever in future history...

The word will still 'exist', as it's part of language... Unike swear words, which we are told 'not to use', they still exist within a language structure, and will do, as long as language exists, whether we're 'allowed' to say them or not.
its' existence isn't the problem, it's the context in which it's used.

When you stub your toe and it hurts like hell, most likely you'll swear... you wouldn't do normally, but in the context of the situation, many people just do!

Some of the most educated, well spoken people I know swear like f#@&ing troopers! Doesn't make them bad people, or ignorant!
It's just up to us, as civilised people, to know when and where to use certain words, and in the correct context.




Funny how this always crops up on the eve of Spurs v. Chelsea/West Ham games... It's almost as if they're anticipating it!
 
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Excuse the long-read reply, but this was my questionnaire response I sent into the club a few years back when asked about fans' thoughts on the subject...

*THE YID DEBATE*

My honest opinion is that I think the TRUE origins of the word have been either lost, forgotten, or ignored by modern Society...

Yid was never originally an offensive word, it really wasn't!

"Reb Yid" was a word that means/meant 'Friend/mate' when said by someone Jewish to someone Jewish, who may not know the other one's name...

..."a nice YIDDESHE boy/girl" was a phrase I used to hear MY Grandparents and older Jewish relatives use regularly when growing up.

I am Jewish, I have heard the word used (within my own family) with only positive connotations in the past...

but yes, I am well aware, and understand that the latter-day use of the word has been taken fom it's original meaning, and warped into something wholly unsavoury by those who choose to abuse Jews.

But let's face it, those same people can still vent anti-Semitic feelings (be it at Spurs fans, or Jews in the street) by hissing at us like a Gas chamber, or 'Seig Heilling' or by calling someone a 'dirty Jew'... all of which are arguably more offensive, yet miraculously don't contain the word 'Yid'.

You only have to look at the true Indian origins and PEACEFUL MEANING of the Swastika to see how a symbol or a word can be turned into something unsavoury and offensive, by those wanting to warp something originally good into something that represents pure evil.

It is no more the job of Indian or Eurasian religions to 'reclaim' the Swastika symbol as their own, than it should be for Jews to reclaim the word YID.

It was ours in the first place, and we were using it just fine before the anti-Semites and racists came along.

If you want to eradicate anti-Semitism and racism, focus on the anti-Semites and racists perhaps!

It's always been about context.

In a football context, (and as a Jewish Spurs fan) I don't see anything wrong with non-Jewish Spurs fans standing alongside Jewish ones, who are prepared to identify with a racial/religious minority by using the word in solidarity and representing togetherness, regardless of race, colour or creed (in keeping with its origins.)

By using it in a positive context for long enough, then maybe one day, its darker historical meaning will start to be eroded and diluted, and who knows, it might even return to it's positive roots as meaning 'mate' or 'friend'?

I know it's a minefield, and a real can of worms that one questionnaire can't really solve... and I get that people who ARE offended by it, have maybe only ever heard it in a negative sense.

But surely it's the job of modern society to turn past negatives into positives, by choosing NOT to bow to small minded bigots who decided that a perfectly decent word was to be redefined, forcing future generations to work out how to change it back.

Eradicating the word from modern day usage won't stop anti-Semitism, (they'll still hate Jews, whether Spurs fans use the word YID or not) you can't stop them THINKING it!

All it will do is merely suspend that words' negative meaning forever in future history...

The word will still 'exist', as it's part of language... unlike swear words which we are told 'not to use', they still exist, and will do, as long as language exists.

When you stub your toe and it hurts like hell, most likely you'll swear... you wouldn't do normally, but in the context of the situation, many people just do!

Some of the most educated, well spoken people I know swear like f#@&ing troopers! Doesn't make them bad people, or ignorant!
It's just up to us, as civilised people, to know when and where to use certain words, and in the correct context.




Funny how this always crops up on the eve of Spurs v. Chelsea/West Ham games... It's almost as if they're anticipating it!

Excellent post.
 
Think the only people who can make a judgement on this are Jewish Spurs supporters - if it upsets them, then yes, we should stop.
However, as pointed out, other supporters can be anti-semitic without using 'yid'. It annoys me that the people trying to stop us using it can't see it.
 
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