Toby Alderweireld

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Boltonspur said:
What happens if Mason gets us into Europe and is appointed manager you dipstick?
Not saying that’s what I want, but can you rule it out?
Toby has already undermined him as a “caretaker” applying your logic, unless you’re suddenly about to suggest he’s going to dance a jig and stay if Ryan gets the gig full time? As for being our best CB and all that other bollocks you’re going off with, it doesn’t take much. Look at our season and he is our senior CB. He’s not in the top 10 CB’s in the premier league any more. Let alone a top 4 CB.
He’s been a good player for us. I won’t ever doubt that. But he’s been bang average for a long time now & “shining” in our defence is t a great endorsement of his continued genius.
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If Mason is appointed manager then Toby will make his decision, but as of now even Mason says he is only manager until the end of the year. There is no disrespect by anyone saying they are waiting when the person himself who is supposedly being disrespected is saying he isn't the long term manager.

He hasn't undermined anyone. It is a ridiculous argument on your part.

As for not being good he is better than any CB at Chelsea (maybe on par with Silva), United, better than every CB other than VVD at Liverpool. So he would easily get big minutes at top 4 clubs.
 
Trotter said:
You have had an absolute mare there.
Unless you somehow think Mason is the only person in the country who does not realise he is only our manager for the next 2 games (which he isn't by the way)
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Go on then Einstein. Who’s a winner, in the running that would join this shit show with Levy maintaining his iron grip over everything and an itchy trigger finger when it comes to managers? If Mason gets us into Europe, don’t be surprised if he gets a 1-2 year contract on small wages to prove himself.
call it a mare if you want when Levy appoints some other bloke. But if Mason gets us into Europe, he’s going to be a serious contender for a short term Levy contract. Make no mistake about that
 
Igula said:
If Mason is appointed manager then Toby will make his decision, but as of now even Mason says he is only manager until the end of the year. There is no disrespect by anyone saying they are waiting when the person himself who is supposedly being disrespected is saying he isn't the long term manager.

He hasn't undermined anyone. It is a ridiculous argument on your part.

As for not being good he is better than any CB at Chelsea (maybe on par with Silva), United, better than every CB other than VVD at Liverpool. So he would easily get big minutes at top 4 clubs.
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Your whole argument is on the basis that he thinks Mason definitely has a temporary gig and he’s still good enough to make a decision when we get someone at a level between Pep & Arteta.
He isn’t good enough any more to have those thoughts. Hasn’t been good enough for a while now. He has a role to play if asked. He isn’t the CB he was and we all loved. He is the best of a pretty rotten bunch. He should feel lucky that there is still enough pap around him to regularly get a game. And that’s down to the senior management. A player like Toby should be sharing his experience with the new crop. Not bigging himself up as still one of the best in his league. Because he isn’t. The fact that a rapidly dwindling 32 year old remains our best defender is more of an indictment of a poor transfer policy than it is of an endorsement of Toby Alderweireld. And also the primary reason why we are fighting to bet into the Thursday night cup against the likes of West Ham
 
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Boltonspur said:
Your whole argument is on the basis that he thinks Mason definitely has a temporary gig and he’s still good enough to make a decision when we get someone at a level between Pep & Arteta.
He isn’t good enough any more to have those thoughts. Hasn’t been good enough for a while now. He has a role to play if asked. He isn’t the CB he was and we all loved. He is the best of a pretty rotten bunch. He should feel lucky that there is still enough pap around him to regularly get a game. And that’s down to the senior management. A player like Toby should be sharing his experience with the new crop. Not bugging himself up as still one of the best in his league. Because he isn’t
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No my whole argument is that there is nothing wrong with what he said, there isn't. That's it cut and dry.

It is easy to see that the point of that comment is to see what his role is because at his age he, rightfully, isn't interested in being a bit player. If the new manager doesn't see a fit for him then he will move on, if there is a place for him he will stay. There is nothing wrong with that, it is what any player would think and do in the summer. It isn't disrespectful, it isn't scheming, it is exactly what he should do.

It isn't him thinking Mason has a temporary gig, everybody Mason included, knows he has a temporary gig because he does.

All the nonsense you write about him being not good, which is pure crap, is meaningless. It has nothing to do with anything. It is just you trying to take cheap shots because of some pathetic vendetta you have against a player that has been nothing but great for us.
 
Boltonspur said:
Go on then Einstein. Who’s a winner, in the running that would join this shit show with Levy maintaining his iron grip over everything and an itchy trigger finger when it comes to managers? If Mason gets us into Europe, don’t be surprised if he gets a 1-2 year contract on small wages to prove himself.
call it a mare if you want when Levy appoints some other bloke. But if Mason gets us into Europe, he’s going to be a serious contender for a short term Levy contract. Make no mistake about that
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Even in the unlikely event that he appoints Mason, he is still not disrespecting or publicly assassinating (your incredible words, not mine) our current incumbent, who is only here for a temporary gig as things stand.
At that stage Mason would be the next manager, and Toby would make his decision based on that, like he will whoever is the permanent appointment.

Again, I will repeat, you have had a total mare, and are now just doubling down..
 
Igula said:
No my whole argument is that there is nothing wrong with what he said, there isn't. That's it cut and dry.

It is easy to see that the point of that comment is to see what his role is because at his age he, rightfully, isn't interested in being a bit player. If the new manager doesn't see a fit for him then he will move on, if there is a place for him he will stay. There is nothing wrong with that, it is what any player would think and do in the summer. It isn't disrespectful, it isn't scheming, it is exactly what he should do.

It isn't him thinking Mason has a temporary gig, everybody Mason included, knows he has a temporary gig because he does.

All the nonsense you write about him being not good, which is pure crap, is meaningless. It has nothing to do with anything. It is just you trying to take cheap shots because of some pathetic vendetta you have against a player that has been nothing but great for us.
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I have no vendetta against him so that’s wrong from the off. I’ve said a few times what a good player he has been for us. He’s maybe even been our best defender this year. But is that saying much?? Really? Our defence has been a shambles all year. He dithered signing his new contract (scheming in my book) waiting to see if he got a better offer and it was all a bit too public at the time. He’s 32 and now saying he’s interested in a move if the new manager isn’t what he wants? As I said at the very beginning, have a great time in Bruges. Been a good player for us (again for the sake of completeness) but his decline is visible and the fact that he’s the best of a bad bunch suggests that it’s our lack of ambition in the transfer market that led to this, rather than his continued brilliance on the pitch. He is paid to train and play if picked. Not go chatting to the press about him waiting to see who is the next manager. The dog wags the tail, not the other way round
 
Trotter said:
Even in the unlikely event that he appoints Mason, he is still not disrespecting or publicly assassinating (your incredible words, not mine) our current incumbent, who is only here for a temporary gig as things stand.
At that stage Mason would be the next manager, and Toby would make his decision based on that, like he will whoever is the permanent appointment.

Again, I will repeat, you have had a total mare, and are now just doubling down..
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Rubbish. It is disrespectful to publicly say “I’m waiting to see who replaces Ryan Mason before I decide what I’m doing next because I’m still good enough to determine that”. He should be thankful to pull our shirt on. The fact that he’s still getting that chance says more about our transfer policy than it does about his sustained ability.
Who is coming in to replace the 29 year old Spurs fan, career tragically ended, who saves the season and gets Levy some Europa dosh? I’m waiting.
 
Boltonspur said:
I have no vendetta against him so that’s wrong from the off. I’ve said a few times what a good player he has been for us. He’s maybe even been our best defender this year. But is that saying much?? Really? Our defence has been a shambles all year. He dithered signing his new contract (scheming in my book) waiting to see if he got a better offer and it was all a bit too public at the time. He’s 32 and now saying he’s interested in a move if the new manager isn’t what he wants? As I said at the very beginning, have a great time in Bruges. Been a good player for us (again for the sake of completeness) but his decline is visible and the fact that he’s the best of a bad bunch suggests that it’s our lack of ambition in the transfer market that led to this, rather than his continued brilliance on the pitch. He is paid to train and play if picked. Not go chatting to the press about him waiting to see who is the next manager. The dog wags the tail, not the other way round
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Its not just that he has been our best defender he has been better than the vast majority of CBs in the league this year including many at top 4 clubs.

Out of curiosity do you think it is disrespectful when media and fans talk about what the new manager will do next season? Who that new manager will be? Is it disrepectful when Mason talks about how his future will be decided in the summer?

His scheming by doing what every athlete in every sport does and seeing what offers he might get is laughable, I guess that is Sonny out there scheming by not signing his new deal either. What scum these guys are trying to see if they can maximize their earnings in their short careers.
 
Igula said:
Its not just that he has been our best defender he has been better than the vast majority of CBs in the league this year including many at top 4 clubs.
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Only when he's been fully fit -

Toby managed 2,061 minutes in the EPL this year, compare that to 2020 2,958 and 2019 2,924 that's a massive drop off ... that's to be expected from a 32 year old.

That's way less than Maguire and Dias played and what a fit VdV would have played .... and it will only get less going forward as age inevitably slows Toby down even more.

Joachim Andersen managed 2,672 minutes in a poor Fulham side and still managed a decent OPTA rating, at just 24 with a year's EPL experience we should snap him up.
 
The Outsider said:
Only when he's been fully fit -

Toby managed 2,061 minutes in the EPL this year, compare that to 2020 2,958 and 2019 2,924 that's a massive drop off ... that's to be expected from a 32 year old.

That's way less than Maguire and Dias played and what a fit VdV would have played .... and it will only get less going forward as age inevitably slows Toby down even more.

Joachim Andersen managed 2,672 minutes in a poor Fulham side and still managed a decent OPTA rating, at just 24 with a year's EPL experience we should snap him up.
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A lot of the reason that he didn't play minutes was because of Jose sitting him out for no reason not because of fitness issues. There is no reason he didn't play 90 minutes in all 38 PL games for us this other than we had a moron as a manager for most of the year.

I would love to have the CB depth to be able to easily move on from Toby but the reality is it is unlikely we bring in a better CB in the summer and we have nobody better in our squad currently.

I have made my feelings about Anderson known in the transfer thread so all I will say here is meh.
 
Igula said:
Its not just that he has been our best defender he has been better than the vast majority of CBs in the league this year including many at top 4 clubs.

Out of curiosity do you think it is disrespectful when media and fans talk about what the new manager will do next season? Who that new manager will be? Is it disrepectful when Mason talks about how his future will be decided in the summer?

His scheming by doing what every athlete in every sport does and seeing what offers he might get is laughable, I guess that is Sonny out there scheming by not signing his new deal either. What scum these guys are trying to see if they can maximize their earnings in their short careers.
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Rather than giving out a disagree to everything you post I will try to answer you. Hope that’s ok?
He really isn’t one of the best defenders in the league any more, regardless of league placings. Your eyes (& the stats) should tell you that. He is bang average these days and on a rapid decline. The fact that he is probably still our best defender says more about us than it does about him.
I think it is disrespectful for a player who trains with the club daily and remains available for selection to speak out in public about what they may do if they do/don’t get the manager of their liking. Not even Harry Kane has spoken publicly. It’s all speculation about what “sources close to the player” say or what other pundits think. And that’s a player at his peak, not past it. Media speculation has fuck all to do with it. They are born disrespectful. So that’s irrelevant The fan part I agree with. We pay his wages and keep the club alive (ot at least used to in an era where players would keep it buttoned). So you’re entitled to support your man. I’m entitled to say he’s out of order by hedging his bets and disrespecting the incumbent manager.
ive no issue with these athletes getting the max out of their careers & contracts. But keep it professional & private. Like Sonny has. It’s between him, THFC & his advisers. Not something that the player should go trotting off to the press about.
 
Boltonspur said:
Rather than giving out a disagree to everything you post I will try to answer you. Hope that’s ok?
He really isn’t one of the best defenders in the league any more, regardless of league placings. Your eyes (& the stats) should tell you that. He is bang average these days and on a rapid decline. The fact that he is probably still our best defender says more about us than it does about him.
I think it is disrespectful for a player who trains with the club daily and remains available for selection to speak out in public about what they may do if they do/don’t get the manager of their liking. Not even Harry Kane has spoken publicly. It’s all speculation about what “sources close to the player” say or what other pundits think. And that’s a player at his peak, not past it. Media speculation has fuck all to do with it. They are born disrespectful. So that’s irrelevant The fan part I agree with. We pay his wages and keep the club alive (ot at least used to in an era where players would keep it buttoned). So you’re entitled to support your man. I’m entitled to say he’s out of order by hedging his bets and disrespecting the incumbent manager.
ive no issue with these athletes getting the max out of their careers & contracts. But keep it professional & private. Like Sonny has. It’s between him, THFC & his advisers. Not something that the player should go trotting off to the press about.
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LOL

You are free to do whatever you like.

He is one of the best defenders my eyes tell me that every week, watching him and others at other clubs.

We can go back and forth but you are flat out wrong. There is nothing wrong in what he said. Kane is not saying anything because he is in a totally different spot to Toby.

There really is not anything remotely disrespectful at all in what he said and a reason only you with an axe to grind is crying about it.
 
Igula said:
LOL

You are free to do whatever you like.

He is one of the best defenders my eyes tell me that every week, watching him and others at other clubs.

We can go back and forth but you are flat out wrong. There is nothing wrong in what he said. Kane is not saying anything because he is in a totally different spot to Toby.

There really is not anything remotely disrespectful at all in what he said and a reason only you with an axe to grind is crying about it.
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:mourloopy:
ok
 
Igula said:
A lot of the reason that he didn't play minutes was because of Jose sitting him out for no reason not because of fitness issues. There is no reason he didn't play 90 minutes in all 38 PL games for us this other than we had a moron as a manager for most of the year.

I would love to have the CB depth to be able to easily move on from Toby but the reality is it is unlikely we bring in a better CB in the summer and we have nobody better in our squad currently.

I have made my feelings about Anderson known in the transfer thread so all I will say here is meh.
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So the 4 games missed with a back injury were fake? OK got it, your agenda once again overtakes reality.
 
The Outsider said:
"There is no reason he didn't play 90 minutes in all 38 PL games for us this other than we had a moron as a manager for most of the year"

Did you not just say this? .... maybe you were hacked?
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Truth is, if he had been fit for all the games he should have played them. It still doesn’t change the fact that he would have been the pick of a very average bunch in an umambitious/underwhelming season and that isn’t down to the player. He should have been phased out with Jan.
 
The Outsider said:
"There is no reason he didn't play 90 minutes in all 38 PL games for us this other than we had a moron as a manager for most of the year"

Did you not just say this? .... maybe you were hacked?
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Hacked why?

That doesn't say that the injury was fake, just that I missed the 4 games he was out for the supposed back injury.
 
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