Unstoppable force (Watford) vs Immovable object (Spurs) Sunday 2 September

[Airfixx]

So your premise is that we have strength in depth and competition for places?

Mine is that we don't.

Indeed, but my point is underlined by the fact that we would be struggling right now (given the absense of Lamela & Son) IF we didn't have notable depth. When everyone is fit, we have two class AMs on our bench at any one time. We're approaching that state of affairs now.

You're opinion is underlined by "Waaaa! We lost... Buy, buy, buy... Look at Liverpool".

I forgot all about Sturridge! If Mane and Firmino have four bad games on the trot they are in serious danger of being dropped. Eriksen isn't because there is no-one to replace him (Winks/Lamela - give me a break, you'll be saying that Sissoko could do a job!)

...Apparently I just hold many of our players in higher regard than you.

You're all over the place with the Liverpool shit.

 

[Airfixx]

Your unwavering confidence in the status quo is to be admired mate and I genuinely mean that, but if the club and scouting system can't find an upgrade at left back for Ben Davies then we really are in trouble. What are you suggesting, that we keep Ben and never attempt to upgrade out of pure fear that the replacement won't work out?

It's got nothing to do with "unwavering confidence in the status quo"...

1. Simply that given the degree of faith i have in Davies, what you're proposing represents idle tinkering considering the cost and risks involved.

2. Upgrade on Rose, before worrying about replacing Ben.

IF I felt the need for a new #1, maybe it would seem more of a worthwhile risk.

 

[Notabadsquad]

Indeed, but my point is underlined by the fact that we would be struggling right now (given the absense of Lamela & Son) IF we didn't have notable depth. When everyone is fit, we have two class AMs on our bench at any one time. We're approaching that state of affairs now.

You're opinion is underlined by "Waaaa! We lost... Buy, buy, buy... Look at Liverpool".



...Apparently I just hold many of our players in higher regard than you.

You're all over the place with the Liverpool shit.

No spin should gloss over yesterday's lamentable loss and the manager takes much of the blame for reacting too slowly....... .....not for the first time in matches of significance.

 

[Airfixx]

No spin should gloss over yesterday's lamentable loss and the manager takes much of the blame for reacting too slowly....... .....not for the first time in matches of significance.

What spin? I'm not glossing over the result.

It's obvious too that the opinions i'm refuting weren't born of yesterday's loss, The loss is just the first excuse of the season to resurrect and air them.

As if the big takeaway from yesterday is that BD isnt good enough (whilst its insisted that Rose still is).... Laughable!

 

[iz futbal]

snowkarl dont just disagree with posts...try sharing an opinion...clown fire.

Maybe his opinion was he disagrees with you.

 

[Jenny Talia]

I hope so, and that it’s not a case of Poch trying to keep his 3 centre backs happy and, in the process, not steeling up our midfield when it’s needed.

Maybe the reason Poch was so annoyed after the game is that they had scouted Watford, identified the threat in the air from set pieces, played 3 centre backs, then conceded 2 goals to headers.

 

[Jenny Talia]

He is ok and has played well at times but more my point is that some think we can never improve by spending occasionally on quality . I feel we have a couple of positions that could/need upgrading if we want more than top4 . Others believe it's impossible to improve by trying to spend on the odd player unlike the whole football world . They would believe you could reinvent the wheel .

By definition there is always going to be somebody in the "easiest to upgrade" spot.
I agree that right now left back is the most obvious place where we could improve the first team. That doesn't mean Ben is a bad player, or that the Watford defeat was down to him.

 

[BROCKVILLE]

Liverpool do what Spurs can't – and it's been going on for years

I love the Liverpool press. So delusional.
Looking forward to seeing them slip up this season

 

[Fidel Castro]

By definition there is always going to be somebody in the "easiest to upgrade" spot.
I agree that right now left back is the most obvious place where we could improve the first team. That doesn't mean Ben is a bad player, or that the Watford defeat was down to him.

I agree with everything. you say it's just that little extra to push forward.

 

[Bazali]

Maybe the reason Poch was so annoyed after the game is that they had scouted Watford, identified the threat in the air from set pieces, played 3 centre backs, then conceded 2 goals to headers.

And annoyingly the second header came from a player who didn’t even need to jump while his marker, Dembele, was ball watching

 

[Notabadsquad]

Maybe the reason Poch was so annoyed after the game is that they had scouted Watford, identified the threat in the air from set pieces, played 3 centre backs, then conceded 2 goals to headers.

Yep for sure.

It was always going to be a hard game.

We took a fortuitous lead and then lose 2 goals to headers with the much heralded Alderweireld in the team.

No guesses needed for why he was taken off.

 

[Bazali]

Liverpool do what Spurs can't – and it's been going on for years

I love the Liverpool press. So delusional.
Looking forward to seeing them slip up this season

“Going on for years “

LMFAO

Usually we finish above them

 

[Bazali]

Yep for sure.

It was always going to be a hard game.

We took a fortuitous lead and then lose 2 goals to headers with the much heralded Alderweireld in the team.

No guesses needed for why he was taken off.

That’s crap

Toby did ok as did our back three

He was taken off in desperation to try and salvage a draw which we should have done with Kane and Llorente missing sitters

 

[Notabadsquad]

That’s crap

Toby did ok as did our back three

He was taken off in desperation to try and salvage a draw which we should have done with Kane and Llorente missing sitters

Forget the love-in.

All 3 central defenders failed to do their jobs as effectively as they should have done.

We will see who is dropped for the Liverpool game.

 

[Airfixx]

This is exactly the reason to worry. Liverpool and Chelsea are in 2nd gear and still winning game after game and I don't see this stopping at any point.

Imo today showed all we can do this season is challenge for the title and try to win a cup, which I think we're well capable of. Simply don't have the consistency to seriously expect the league, winning the big games is pointless if the week after you play like you're hung over. We'll be up there, but I'd be surprised if we applied any real pressure.

Why is it a given that City and Liverpool will find their groove but we won't?

 

[StripiestPilot]

That’s crap

Toby did ok as did our back three

He was taken off in desperation to try and salvage a draw which we should have done with Kane and Llorente missing sitters

Nobody in the back 3 had a good game. When Watford were asleep we kept them at arm’s length, but that’s easy. Once they started lumping it up there we immediately conceded two goals in quick succession with Toby almost scoring an OG too.

Any defender can look good if they aren’t called on to do any defending, but when the crunch came our guys went missing. It’s annoying because when we had to defend for 20 minutes at Old Trafford against Fellaini hoofball we did it properly. They just didn’t take the game seriously enough against Watford.

 

[Pootle]

Long first post incoming...

I think the players have not adapted their mindset this season the way Poch has. He's not wearing the training tracksuit anymore, he wears a suit every game, he is reintegrating all the players who were on the transfer list, he is not sugar-coating his assessment of performances. We are not a young up-and-coming team anymore, we are a top 3 regular and it's time to become serious contenders. It's time to win trophies and not just gloss over defeats and dropped points by saying "massive effort, maybe we deserved more, etc".

Of course we are still not in peak physical condition after the WC but there should still be an intensity to our performances. When a team like Watford just sit there and stand still for 45 minutes like they did in the first half, we should be going all out to kill the game. Poch is absolutely right that the aggression wasn't there, and when Watford eventually decided they would try and win the game we were stuck in flip-flop mode. You can always lose a game of football but you should never lose because of a lack of effort. Was that really the best offensive play we could muster in the first half? Were those two easy headers lost really the best we can expect from 3 top class CBs?

Long-term this silly result might help us but only if the players are serious about competing for the title. It takes blood, sweat and tears to do that. Talking about the title after winning 3-0 at Old Trafford is all well and good but it makes you look like twats when you throw away a win against Watford 6 days later. Like Poch has been saying, perception and reality are often very different and on another day we could have lost all the matches we played this season. In every single one we had the ball hit our woodwork, opponents miss open goals etc. Our current level of performance is not going to be enough, the players must give much more if they want to be contenders.

Nice first post Mr.StripiestPilot. I'm interested in particular in the idea that "the players must give much more". I don't doubt this is necessary but I'm wondering how this can be achieved. Obviously it's not a case of Poch just telling the players "please give more this week lads" or we'd have done it already (and other teams would do it too!). So how do we get more from the players? Not suggesting you have the answer, just throwing out my musings on the question.

 

[mouse]

A bad result.

Players where complacent i felt. We where cruising in the first half, it felt like it would come as it did against Fulham / Utd. Manager didnt react quickly enough to Watford stepping up the pressure - sucker punches are difficult to counter though.

Watford did what they needed to do and took a physical game to a more technical team. Deeney plays like hes still in the prison yard (did we not know to expect that?), but we still looked in it once they shut up shop with ten mins to go.

Some uncharacteristic sloppy finishing from Kane, pot shots from Eriksen and Alli over complicating things.

Llorente is no option from the bench, but Son and Lamela would normally be miles ahead of him in the pecking order.

Some of the posts in this thread tho =

 

[mouse]

Maybe, like Eriksen , he's disillusioned with our embarrising lack of ambition in the summer transfer window. Maybe, maybe not.
I'm just putting it out there.

Runs for cover

 

[mouse]

Liverpool do what Spurs can't – and it's been going on for years

I love the Liverpool press. So delusional.
Looking forward to seeing them slip up this season

Apparently Jenas has never seem us play badly and still win. Obviously didnt watch us against Utd last week or a good few times every season.

I used to like JJ, but i see he is going down the route of most BBC pundits - relying on cliche ridden hyperbole rather than actual analysis of the game in question. Lazy Journalism