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Yep. Nails it for me.

VAR and the encroachment of pure rationalism
VAR is a symptom. A worryingly advanced symptom of a creeping ailment that is mutating to infect not only football but society at large. I call this sickness bureaucraphilia — an abnormal fondness for, or infatuation with bureaucratic mechanisms of authority.

It is a lust for measurement, a desire for protocol and a fetish for quantity. It is the blindness that sees only in black and white without space for the grey, that exists in a matrix of binary devoid of shade and doubt. It is to kneel open mouthed with tongue hanging out, salivating at the prospect of just a few more boxes that might need to be ticked. You know what we like, don’t pretend that you don’t, stop being such a tease, please, just absolve us of any hint of uncertainty, we’ll do anything you want. Anything.

Just as the road to hell is paved with good intentions, these procedures are implemented under the guise of ‘fairness’. Because everything must be fair, haven’t you heard? For them to be not so, well, that would be inhuman. Of course, the fact that life is not and cannot be fair is immaterial to these crusaders of justice, these avatars of (self) righteousness. And who cares about the chaotic patterns of reality anyway? Why bother with such complexities when simplified models chime so much softer on the conscience? Why waste one’s oh so precious time with the spiralling beauty of the irrational when the straight line logic of blame will suffice? But their second goal was offside! Well, maybe it was.

To apply logic in everything is irrational. A football match is not a machine and so its outcomes should not be corrected through the crunching of data. Thin lipped men bunched together in softly lit rooms with no windows pouring over the freeze-frame stills of the incident in question, measuring and examining with their meticulous little tools of quantification. The players, coaches and fans in the stadium must put their emotions on hold as the soul of football lies prostrate on the table of the grand inquisitor while the white-coated experts extract the passion from the patient. They take time to make sure that they get it all out, they wouldn’t want to leave any in there, its powerful stuff that passion.

The introduction of VAR to football is yet another example of an attempt by humans to control the uncontrollable. It seems to be a great irony that as we revel in the unprecedented freedom of our contemporary, progressive societies that we are simultaneously the most surveilled peoples in history. Freedom is slavery, or something like that. The desire for control, to leave nothing to chance, has been a hallmark of the ego since the dawn of consciousness. The overtly rational mind has long been doomed to fall in love with its own creations. To become a worshipper of false idols.

It seems to me that a foundational aspect of football’s unprecedented and unparalleled popularity is its uncanny accuracy as a sporting facsimile for existence itself. The patterns that emerge during football’s performance seem to map sufficiently well on to those that manifest themselves in reality. And — judging by the actions of the 4 billion followers of football — we generally seem pretty happy about that. Joy, anguish, beauty, suffering, fortune and despair; individual virtuosity and collective harmony. In this sense, football is a team sport that may have more in common with music than rugby or hockey.

Football is the most fluid of team games, infinitely complex in its nature. No two moments on a football pitch can ever be the same, there are too many variables in play. And this complexity carries with it a tremendous degree of uncertainty. Uncertainty, that eternal bane of the ego, that about which one cannot be sure. It is an all too observable trait of modern man to assert certainty in domains where there can be none. Just listen to an economist or a politician.

So, here’s the problem — there are incidents in football that require a judgement call. Very few decisions that the officials must make are binary in nature. I am in favour of goal-line technology, as I am for Hawk-Eye in tennis and the Snickometer in cricket. These technologies are entirely appropriate to sort out these issues of binary, quantitative nature, they are questions of black and white. But these are rare in football. There are numerous incidents — I would suggest the majority — that require the subjective view of the officials.

I don’t imagine that there are many who are arguing that this is not the case. The advocates of VAR are merely pointing out that the implementation of the technology will reduce the percentage of decisions that, on later analysis, are deemed to be wrong. And who would argue against that? Why would one not want to see a decrease in the proportion of incorrect decisions? And fair enough, on the face of it these seem like reasonable questions. But on closer inspection we can uncover the deception.

There is a slight of hand in play here, the argument for VAR uses the language of quantity as its justification — ‘reduce the percentage’, ‘decrease in proportion’, ‘get more decisions right’. But football is not only a question of quantity, logic and cold rationality, it is a game of human relationships, of animal passions and natural desires.

And humans are not entirely rational beings, rationality is but an afterthought, we are evolved to act on instinct and our actions are often guided by passion rather than reason. When the goal-scoring striker rips the shirt from his chest and swings it wildly above his head as he sprints behind the goal before the celebrating masses he is not channeling the influence of logic and rational thought. His faculties have been taken over by Mother Nature herself, in this moment he is more Amazonian warrior than member of modern society, more raiding Apache chief than obedient little rat-racer.

The reality of the context really matters, everything is linked to everything else. Everything flows. As the great footballing iconoclast, Juanma Lillo explains in an interview with Sid Lowe for The Blizzard –

‘Do you buy a paper on a Monday morning for a Euro and the only thing in it is list after list of results? Do you go into a football stadium, in the last minute of the game, have a look at the scoreboard and leave? You watch 90 minutes, which is the process’

VAR interferes with the flow of the game. It interrupts the tempo. Football is as much theatre as it is sport, as much a drama as it is a game. Is there even a difference? After all, all of the world is a stage…

The quantitative increase in decision making efficiency is achieved at the cost of the emotive impact of the game itself and it is my contention that this represents an unacceptable infringement upon passion by reason. It is an attempted power grab by a bureaucratic faction gone rogue, an annexing of ground to which it is has no right. The relentless advance of the bureaucraphiliacs is like a zombie apocalypse. These sticklers and nitpickers indeed seem dead inside, devoid of human spirit, lost without a yardstick to consult. Their campaign to eradicate human error from humans is a tyranny founded upon an absurdity. These joyless bean counters need to learn how to ‘live a little’, to ‘let it go’ and embrace a touch of chaos. Its OK not to know, its OK to be unsure, its OK to proclaim that ‘God only knows’.

I am cautiously optimistic that as the introduction of VAR continues to cause exasperation and confusion among the football community, the opposition to it will become too strong and it will go down as a ‘good idea in principle’ that just ‘didn’t work out’. But it is not a good idea in principle or otherwise, it is a terrible one, and the fact that it has been allowed to get this far is a damning indictment of the governing authority’s understanding of the foundational nature of the game. It is profoundly worrying that the bureaucrats have been able to become so powerful and the pushback must be strong lest we risk losing the very spirit to which our love of the game is inexorably bound.


With respect to you Guido, that’s a load of pseudo-intellectual, melodramatic, football hipster cobblers. And I’m not a fan of VAR.
 
As long as officials actually read the memo about "clear and obvious" it will be much more successful than last time.

But the main issue they had was doing too much too soon. Start simple - penalties only, for example - and work your way from there.

Similarly, impose a time limit. If you can't make a decision within 30 seconds chances are it's not clear and obvious, so go with the on field call.
 
watch Leeds disallowed goal against Palace
Bamford - who was clearly onside, had his goal disallowed as he pointed to where he wanted the ball, and his hand was adjudged to have been offside.

football refereeing is totally and utterly fucked

VAR is now in the hands of the monster raving loony party.

mental
 
The passion of seeing a goal scored, even legitimate ones is slowly being drained away from the fans because you have to wait for VAR. VAR and the buffoons that implement it are ruining football. The flow and speed of the game is being bogged down by stupid offsides (offside by a pube, big toe or an arm). The refs are still getting handball decisions wrong - see mactominey v Southampton. The same mistakes are still being made by referees as they were years ago, only it's worse now because some fool 50 miles away looks for reasons to rule out goals. The one west ham got ruled out yesterday was bordering on corruption or incompetence. If this continues it will drive fans away
 
Yeah I get that.

But was it glorious when Sterling scored and VAR ruled it offside and Spurs away crowd went crazy?

One of the best moments of me following Spurs, helped by VAR.
That is not the essence of the game for me. We all accepted referees making decisions, some wrong and some right. What it never did was interrupt the spontaneity of the moment. That is being taken away from the paying fans. Loose that, you’ve lost the game.

Anyone enjoy fanless stadiums during COVID? Anyone?
 
I disagree ( I dont tend to click on the disagree button , and I havent) But VAR is usually correct in its decision but the deployment , the time taken, ect are are spoiling the game.
Perhaps VAR should only give decisions on fact , opinion decisions should be down to the Ref and only the Ref. ( IMO)

Wasn’t VaR originally designed to overturn major errors not boardline. Just feels like the deployment has been jobs worths in nature, no common sense.
 
Problem is rugby and cricket lend themselves to VAR. football doesn’t. It’s explosive, sudden, spontaneous. VAR just fucks it all up. It makes it so hard to give that sudden outpouring of emotion when your team scores. Immediately now most fans first reaction is “Will it go to VAR”. It is shit.
The VAR decision in the Bournemouth v Burnley game today took over 5 minutes .

The fans in the stadium haven’t a fucking clue what is going on in making the decision .

Is that the way to treat paying customers ?

VAR is being implemented by totally incompetent individuals and is killing the beautiful game
 
And that is different from celebrating a goal only to then see the flag up for offsides how?

It takes seconds at best to realise a goal has been flagged offside. That’s very different to expecting every goal to be subject to a 5 minute review by people who don’t understand the rules of the game.

There’s probably some minor incident in the buildup to Aguero’s famous last gasp title winning goal. Imagine VAR in that situation, with a similar outcome to Lamela’s perfectly legitimate goal. There would have been riots.

VAR could end up killing the sport.
 
Disaster. Let the fans go wild with excitement only to disallow it 3mins latter, then endure the near constant media outrage and coverage that will follow instead of analysing the game.

It’s going to kill the game if it’s allowed to become standard.

Eventually fans won’t be going wild at all, as everyone will be wondering if some timid brush of shoulders 30 yards from the action is going to cause a goal to be disallowed. The euphoria of the moment will be gone.
 


Yep. Nails it for me.

VAR and the encroachment of pure rationalism
VAR is a symptom. A worryingly advanced symptom of a creeping ailment that is mutating to infect not only football but society at large. I call this sickness bureaucraphilia — an abnormal fondness for, or infatuation with bureaucratic mechanisms of authority.

It is a lust for measurement, a desire for protocol and a fetish for quantity. It is the blindness that sees only in black and white without space for the grey, that exists in a matrix of binary devoid of shade and doubt. It is to kneel open mouthed with tongue hanging out, salivating at the prospect of just a few more boxes that might need to be ticked. You know what we like, don’t pretend that you don’t, stop being such a tease, please, just absolve us of any hint of uncertainty, we’ll do anything you want. Anything.

Just as the road to hell is paved with good intentions, these procedures are implemented under the guise of ‘fairness’. Because everything must be fair, haven’t you heard? For them to be not so, well, that would be inhuman. Of course, the fact that life is not and cannot be fair is immaterial to these crusaders of justice, these avatars of (self) righteousness. And who cares about the chaotic patterns of reality anyway? Why bother with such complexities when simplified models chime so much softer on the conscience? Why waste one’s oh so precious time with the spiralling beauty of the irrational when the straight line logic of blame will suffice? But their second goal was offside! Well, maybe it was.

To apply logic in everything is irrational. A football match is not a machine and so its outcomes should not be corrected through the crunching of data. Thin lipped men bunched together in softly lit rooms with no windows pouring over the freeze-frame stills of the incident in question, measuring and examining with their meticulous little tools of quantification. The players, coaches and fans in the stadium must put their emotions on hold as the soul of football lies prostrate on the table of the grand inquisitor while the white-coated experts extract the passion from the patient. They take time to make sure that they get it all out, they wouldn’t want to leave any in there, its powerful stuff that passion.

The introduction of VAR to football is yet another example of an attempt by humans to control the uncontrollable. It seems to be a great irony that as we revel in the unprecedented freedom of our contemporary, progressive societies that we are simultaneously the most surveilled peoples in history. Freedom is slavery, or something like that. The desire for control, to leave nothing to chance, has been a hallmark of the ego since the dawn of consciousness. The overtly rational mind has long been doomed to fall in love with its own creations. To become a worshipper of false idols.

It seems to me that a foundational aspect of football’s unprecedented and unparalleled popularity is its uncanny accuracy as a sporting facsimile for existence itself. The patterns that emerge during football’s performance seem to map sufficiently well on to those that manifest themselves in reality. And — judging by the actions of the 4 billion followers of football — we generally seem pretty happy about that. Joy, anguish, beauty, suffering, fortune and despair; individual virtuosity and collective harmony. In this sense, football is a team sport that may have more in common with music than rugby or hockey.

Football is the most fluid of team games, infinitely complex in its nature. No two moments on a football pitch can ever be the same, there are too many variables in play. And this complexity carries with it a tremendous degree of uncertainty. Uncertainty, that eternal bane of the ego, that about which one cannot be sure. It is an all too observable trait of modern man to assert certainty in domains where there can be none. Just listen to an economist or a politician.

So, here’s the problem — there are incidents in football that require a judgement call. Very few decisions that the officials must make are binary in nature. I am in favour of goal-line technology, as I am for Hawk-Eye in tennis and the Snickometer in cricket. These technologies are entirely appropriate to sort out these issues of binary, quantitative nature, they are questions of black and white. But these are rare in football. There are numerous incidents — I would suggest the majority — that require the subjective view of the officials.

I don’t imagine that there are many who are arguing that this is not the case. The advocates of VAR are merely pointing out that the implementation of the technology will reduce the percentage of decisions that, on later analysis, are deemed to be wrong. And who would argue against that? Why would one not want to see a decrease in the proportion of incorrect decisions? And fair enough, on the face of it these seem like reasonable questions. But on closer inspection we can uncover the deception.

There is a slight of hand in play here, the argument for VAR uses the language of quantity as its justification — ‘reduce the percentage’, ‘decrease in proportion’, ‘get more decisions right’. But football is not only a question of quantity, logic and cold rationality, it is a game of human relationships, of animal passions and natural desires.

And humans are not entirely rational beings, rationality is but an afterthought, we are evolved to act on instinct and our actions are often guided by passion rather than reason. When the goal-scoring striker rips the shirt from his chest and swings it wildly above his head as he sprints behind the goal before the celebrating masses he is not channeling the influence of logic and rational thought. His faculties have been taken over by Mother Nature herself, in this moment he is more Amazonian warrior than member of modern society, more raiding Apache chief than obedient little rat-racer.

The reality of the context really matters, everything is linked to everything else. Everything flows. As the great footballing iconoclast, Juanma Lillo explains in an interview with Sid Lowe for The Blizzard –

‘Do you buy a paper on a Monday morning for a Euro and the only thing in it is list after list of results? Do you go into a football stadium, in the last minute of the game, have a look at the scoreboard and leave? You watch 90 minutes, which is the process’

VAR interferes with the flow of the game. It interrupts the tempo. Football is as much theatre as it is sport, as much a drama as it is a game. Is there even a difference? After all, all of the world is a stage…

The quantitative increase in decision making efficiency is achieved at the cost of the emotive impact of the game itself and it is my contention that this represents an unacceptable infringement upon passion by reason. It is an attempted power grab by a bureaucratic faction gone rogue, an annexing of ground to which it is has no right. The relentless advance of the bureaucraphiliacs is like a zombie apocalypse. These sticklers and nitpickers indeed seem dead inside, devoid of human spirit, lost without a yardstick to consult. Their campaign to eradicate human error from humans is a tyranny founded upon an absurdity. These joyless bean counters need to learn how to ‘live a little’, to ‘let it go’ and embrace a touch of chaos. Its OK not to know, its OK to be unsure, its OK to proclaim that ‘God only knows’.

I am cautiously optimistic that as the introduction of VAR continues to cause exasperation and confusion among the football community, the opposition to it will become too strong and it will go down as a ‘good idea in principle’ that just ‘didn’t work out’. But it is not a good idea in principle or otherwise, it is a terrible one, and the fact that it has been allowed to get this far is a damning indictment of the governing authority’s understanding of the foundational nature of the game. It is profoundly worrying that the bureaucrats have been able to become so powerful and the pushback must be strong lest we risk losing the very spirit to which our love of the game is inexorably bound.


Never has so much been written to say so little.

Whether you like VAR or not that was nauseating
 
Why? Unfortunately what happened in last season's CL didn't exist in the bizarre alternative future paradigm supposedly being created in the PL next season by Riley.

We all want hand ball to be qualified better, but what isn't workable is PL referees deciding they are going to have different laws, or applications and "interpretations" of laws to UEFA, FIFA and the rest of the footballing world - so having different applications of rules in the PL and CL for example.

That's just fucking ridiculous. Adding more "interpretation" to a rule doesn't clarify it, it just muddles it further, as individuals will "interpret" things differently constantly, and all the usual bullshit will come into play, home ground, home fans noise pressure, players inn their fucking ear.

What needs clarifying is what is deemed as genuinely accidental or incidental. What should also be changed is that penalties shouldn't be given for fouls or handballs where there is no clear goal scoring opportunity, or clear creation of a goal scoring opportunity involved. That would clear much more of the silly bullshit up.

I guarantee you what Sissoko did will be given as handball again and again, regardless of what that prick Riley says because anyone standing with his arm out like that will always run the risk of a ref "interpreting" as a handball. And I guarantee you'd have been screaming injustice if that hadn't been given to us up the other end.
YOU!! Are one of the only people interpreting Sissoko’s as Handball. Everyone has seen it come off his fucking chest first and it’s fucking obvious to any normal human that pointing to your team mate is not under ANY interpretation of the new or old laws of handball an act of deliberately handballing or an attempt to making yourself bigger to block the opponent.

It is if you have a confirmation bias against a player and look for blame even if there is nothing to blame.
 
My concerns with it still is that they're using awful camera angles that mean the VAR official has to guess where to put the lines. There's no way that can be done accurately from a camera that's so far behind play. They're also arbitrarily choosing the frame to use as the reference which means the outcome can be manipulated by choosing a frame that looks more or less likely to be offside. If I recall correctly they're only using 24fps footage which is too slow for fast action.
 
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They should simply bin it off.

For the measurement to be accurate:
1. They should factor in the frame rate of the camera
2. Agree on is it when the ball is hit or when it leaves the boot
3. Measure point 2 when also measuring the player supposed to be offside
4. Take the offside measurement using the placement of the foot furthermost (before anyone says what about headers, I'd say fuck headers)

It should be binned as per above example renders the entire measurement ridiculous.

Son has not gained an advantage here. No defender or attacking player will no if a player is offside, there is zero skill involved from either a defender playing attacker offside or attacker beating the offside trap. It's just a guess.

They should just stop using the lines altogether. If the VAR official cannot see a clear offside with just his eyes looking at the image, give the goal. We should be ruling goals out for clear and obvious errors not this GCSE Maths shit.
 
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