Japhet Tanganga

[ryuzakiluke100]

Sergio Ramos was pushed to play as RB for few years to gain experience before he's ready to stake a claim as center back. And it's not rare for this change of position.

For a young defender, I think getting more game time even as less preferred position is important for the development.

 

[Airfixx]

Aurier now has less than 2 years left on his contract. So he will either sign another contract before summer or be sold.

Tanganga is a versatile defender who will be played in a variety of positions until more experienced, when he'll find his 'usual' position whether as a FB or CB.

Tbh, I'd like to see him get a year's loan similar to the one Skippy is having......

 

[ryuzakiluke100]

Tbh, I'd like to see him get a year's loan similar to the one Skippy is having......

Not this season IMO.

And during this season, with better luck with injury Tanganga may become a more regular, and earn the keep for next season.

Skipp option to get game time with us this season is very limited, hence it's better for him to get a loan. Tanganga's versatility means he can fill in in different scenario and we need depth in the defense at the moment.

Mourinho described Tangaga as "multi functional" in this press conference when being asked.

 

[TimothéeAtouba]

Not this season IMO.

And during this season, with better luck with injury Tanganga may become a more regular, and earn the keep for next season.

Skipp option to get game time with us is very limited, hence it's better for him to get a loan. Tanganga's versatility means he can fill in in different scenario and we need depth in the defense at the moment.

Mourinho described Tangaga as "multi functional" in this press conference when being asked.

Agreed, with Sanchez out of favour and possible future injuries, Tanganga will get game time this season.

He might even fill the backup LB position with Davies playing a backup CB role.

 

[Spursidol]

Tbh, I'd like to see him get a year's loan similar to the one Skippy is having......

Its on the margins I think whether a loan is better or staying at Spurs - latter if he plays enough though. He's already made just under 20 appearances, almost all (but possibly all) as starts and I suspect by the end of this season he will have 30+ games under his belt as he's versatile to play FB and CB so lots of players to cover.

I think that's enough experience for him to stay at Spurs to be one of the squad. Not sure he'd benefit from going on loan unless Toby stayed next season and Japhet went on loan knowing he'd be taking Toby's place when he was back.

Slightly different to Skipp who made a lot of his Spurs appearances off the bench, after a promising start to his Spurs career when he was playing 90 minutes a game.

 

[NW1Spur]

He needs to go on loan in Jan. He just isn't going to get enough game of time here.

 

[Airfixx]

Not this season IMO.

And during this season, with better luck with injury Tanganga may become a more regular, and earn the keep for next season.

Skipp option to get game time with us is very limited, hence it's better for him to get a loan. Tanganga's versatility means he can fill in in different scenario and we need depth in the defense at the moment.

Mourinho described Tangaga as "multi functional" in this press conference when being asked.

I don't agree in terms of likelyhood of gametime... I think it's somewhat the opposite (tho I am still glad that Skippy went on loan):

CB: Toby, Dier, Sanchez, Rodon, Davies
FB: Serge, MD, Reggie, Davies, Cirkin

DM: PEH...... Winks? Sissoko?


His own fitness aside, Japhet is getting a steady flow of game-time is dependent on a string of injuries.

If he can in the remainder of his season cement himself as a primary back-up in one position or another then great; otherwise he's better of seeking regular senior football for a year..... Something that until now he's still had relatively bugger all of.

 

[Airfixx]

Its on the margins I think whether a loan is better or staying at Spurs - latter if he plays enough though. He's already made just under 20 appearances, almost all (but possibly all) as starts and I suspect by the end of this season he will have 30+ games under his belt as he's versatile to play FB and CB so lots of players to cover.

I think that's enough experience for him to stay at Spurs to be one of the squad. Not sure he'd benefit from going on loan unless Toby stayed next season and Japhet went on loan knowing he'd be taking Toby's place when he was back.

Slightly different to Skipp who made a lot of his Spurs appearances off the bench, after a promising start to his Spurs career when he was playing 90 minutes a game.

Apps to date:

 

[Totti]

Apps to date:

Jesus christ

6 games in the Prem for us and we manage less than 1 point per game.

 

[ryuzakiluke100]

I don't agree in terms of likelyhood of gametime... I think it's somewhat the opposite (tho I am still glad that Skippy went on loan):

CB: Toby, Dier, Sanchez, Rodon, Davies
FB: Serge, MD, Reggie, Davies, Cirkin

DM: PEH...... Winks? Sissoko?


His own fitness aside, Japhet is getting a steady flow of game-time is dependent on a string of injuries.

If he can in the remainder of his season cement himself as a primary back-up in one position or another then great; otherwise he's better of seeking regular senior football for a year..... Something that until now he's still had relatively bugger all of.

With midfield, Dier is still an option. Certain opposition may require tweak in tactic like Pepe at Real Madrid, Ander Herrera at Man U and Zanetti at Inter to play a pseudo defender midfielder role to track false #9/ roaming attacker. Fergie did something similar with Phil Jones to maintain double mark on Bale. I think that's why managers really appreciate having someone like Dier.

With the point above in mind, if we switch to that tactic (which usually 3 at the back), there is less reliance on having an out and out defensive midfielder to sit in front of the defensive line. NDombele and GLC can do a job as box to box together or with one of the PEH, Winks, Sissoko. Ndombele and PEH in the team really had upped the competition for game time in midfield from past season, while with our defensive option, despite addition of Reguilon, Rodon and Doherty, it's only just replacement for number of outgoing players. There is opening for competition.

IMO, the spine positions, central area, is tougher to tinker with. Skipp if he had stayed would be at the very bottom of the pecking order, while Tanganga's versatility may allow him to get minutes as full back. As we saw last season, Tanganga is ahead of Cirkin even for the LB back up role. Toby age and Sanchez's stagnation in development may open some game time for Tanganga. If not for his injury, he would have gotten more game time by now IMO.

Edit: David Luiz was also used in that pseudo defender midfielder hybrid role under Mourinho at Chelsea.

 

[Spursidol]

Apps to date:

I made the mistake of looking at Wiki, he made 11 appearances last season, all/mainly starts I think.

Depends this season on how much he plays as to whether a loan is sensible or not

 

[Totti]

I made the mistake of looking at Wiki, he made 11 appearances last season, all/mainly starts I think.

Depends this season on how much he plays as to whether a loan is sensible or not

Started 11 games last season.

We won 3 of them. 2 of which were in the FA Cup against Championship Middlesbrough and Southampton.

 

[Airfixx]

With midfield, Dier is still an option. Certain opposition may require tweak in tactic like Pepe at Real Madrid, Ander Herrera at Man U and Zanetti at Inter to play a pseudo defender midfielder role to track false #9/ roaming attacker. Fergie did something similar with Phil Jones to maintain double mark on Bale. I think that's why managers really appreciate having someone like Dier.

With the point above in mind, if we switch to that tactic (which usually 3 at the back), there is less reliance on having an out and out defensive midfielder to sit in front of the defensive line. NDombele and GLC can do a job as box to box together or with one of the PEH, Winks, Sissoko. Ndombele and PEH in the team really had upped the competition for game time in midfield from past season, while with our defensive option, despite addition of Reguilon, Rodon and Doherty, it's only just replacement for number of outgoing players. There is opening for competition.

IMO, the spine positions, central area, is tougher to tinker with. Skipp if he had stayed would be at the very bottom of the pecking order, while Tanganga's versatility may allow him to get minutes as full back. As we saw last season, Tanganga is ahead of Cirkin even for the LB back up role. Toby age and Sanchez's stagnation in development may open some game time for Tanganga. If not for his injury, he would have gotten more game time by now IMO.

Looking at the CM/DM thing more simply....

With PEH / Ndombele / Sissoko or 1st choice 3 right now, it's perfectly within reason that in the EL we'd have been playing Skipp and/or Winks along with Gio is he'd stayed..... And with Winks struggling to impose himself atm, there's no reason why Skipp couldn't have made that gametime his own and then became an option for a latter minute sub to help close out games.

Time will tell with Tanganga over the remainder of this season, but that's a shit load of players to be battling with for gametime as a newbie.... Even if you are considered versatile, there's specialist depth ahead of him in every position.

 

[ryuzakiluke100]

Looking at the CM/DM thing more simply....

With PEH / Ndombele / Sissoko or 1st choice 3 right now, it's perfectly within reason that in the EL we'd have been playing Skipp and/or Winks along with Gio is he'd stayed..... And with Winks struggling to impose himself atm, there's no reason why Skipp couldn't have made that gametime his own and then became an option for a latter minute sub to help close out games.

Time will tell with Tanganga over the remainder of this season, but that's a shit load of players to be battling with for gametime as a newbie.... Even if you are considered versatile, there's specialist depth ahead of him in every position.

EL games as we saw doesn't guarantee full game time for second string players. PEH started the first game to make sure kickstart going smoothly. Terrible second game means that some players even get their game time limited than they had already had. And some regular need minutes in EL to condition themselves (GLC).

When a team try to close out the game, it's usually between defender and attacker swap, as desperate opposition often bypass midfield and go direct. Unless it's Fellaini type of midfielder, which I don't see Skipp as one, it's very unlikely a midfielder getting a nod over a defender.

 

[Airfixx]

EL games as we saw doesn't guarantee full game time for second string players. PEH started the first game to make sure kickstart going smoothly. Terrible second game means that some players even get more limited game time than they had already had. And some regular need minutes in EL to condition themselves (GLC).

If Skipp had played EL game 1 and played well he'd have secured a start for the next EL game....

To assume otherwise is muddy thinking.

(We're not talking him being promoted to EPL starter here....)

When a team try to close out the game, it's usually between defender and attacker swap, as desperate opposition often bypass midfield and go direct. Unless it's Fellaini type of midfielder, which I don't see Skipp as one, it's very unlikely a midfielder getting a nod over a defender.

vs Newcastle: Lamela on 79. Ndombele on 77.
vs West Ham: Winks on 73, Moura 80.

Why am I not seeing defenders brought on in these scenarios if what you say is true to us?

Fact is both games see us bringing on the most defensive minded MFs we had on the bench at the time.

 

[ryuzakiluke100]

If Skipp had played EL game 1 and played well he'd have secured a start for the next EL game....

To assume otherwise is muddy thinking.

(We're not talking him being promoted to EPL starter here....)



vs Newcastle: Lamela on 79. Ndombele on 77.
vs West Ham: Winks on 73, Moura 80.

Why am I not seeing defenders brought on in these scenarios if what you say is true to us?

Fact is both games see us bringing on the most defensive minded MFs we had on the bench at the time.

And the point is with EL, you only have around handful of games per season. Once it's Knockout phase, it's just like the Pre qualification round where it would involve less tinkering and shuffling.

Tanganga is at the point where he's trusted in important games. Even if he's not getting start, he would still get minutes.

You would have to look at context of the bench, and schedule. We know how crammed up the schedule around Newcastle game, right?

Reguilon was freshly bought. He was not ready to be tried in PL, when we couldn't get the second goal against Newcastle. If you brought Toby on, then it meant pushing Davies out as wingback which he's useless. He can't attack well, nor we needed more defenders, as we completely shut Newcastle down as is. They got nothing from the game if not for ridiculous VAR penalty decision. And all in all, it would have negated the point about resting Toby for Chelsea, and soon enough another EL pre qualification round.

Against West Ham, Dier missed out due to injury after international duty. We don't have a good header to subbed in, and the score line until the freak show of the last 10 minutes was comfortable enough to tinker with giving players minutes (Bale) and resting players (Son and NDombele). GLC would have been straight sub for NDombele if it weren't for his injury, instead of Winks!

The context clearly indicates a pecking order, and regime of rotation (giving minutes and resting), which Skipp until he proves himself (he is IMO) on loan, would have been very limited with game time. Winks, Sanchez, Dele having their second chance which looks like they're blowing it up. Without hindsight, they're the solid back up, rotation option which Skipp was not,

 

[Airfixx]

And the point is EL game you have around handful of game a season. Once it's Knockout phase, it's just like the Pre qualification round where it would involved less tinkering and shuffling.

Tanganga is at the point where he's trusted in important games. Even if he's not getting start, he would

You would have to look at context of the bench, and schedule.

We know how crammed up the schedule around Newcastle game right?

Reguilon was freshly bought. He was not ready to tried in PL when we couldn't get the second goal against Newcastle. If you brought Toby on, then it meant pushing Davies out as wingback which he's useless, and negating the point about resting Toby for Chelsea, and soon enough another EL pre qualification round. We had a crazy amount of games during that time, before wrapping up our final signings.

Against West Ham, Dier missed out due to injury after international duty. We don't have a good header to subbed in, and the score line until the last 10 minutes was comfortable to tinker with giving players minutes (Bale) and resting players (Son and NDombele. GLC would have been straight sub for NDombele if it weren't for his injury, instead o Winks!).

The context clearly indicates a pecking order, and regime of rotation (giving minutes and resting), which Skipp until he proves ( he is IMO) on loan would be very limited in game time. Winks, Sanchez, Dele having their second chance which looks like they're blowing it up with hindsight.

There's also a pecking order for defenders.... Tanganga (despite his baptism by fire against Liverpool last season) is also very low down that.

Tbh, there's so little to the point being debated here I'm not sure it's really worth the subsequent essays on either part.

As I started off saying, unless Tanganga can cement regular football for himself next year by virtue of whatever game-time he is afforded this year; I'd like to see him go on loan and get a full season of starts under his belt somewhere.

On the flipside, hypothetically, if you don't think playing well here this season would have earned Skipp more game-time as the fixtures stacked up then let's just agree to disagree. Ultimately it doesn't matter to me though, because I prefer he that he is at Norwich right now anyway..... The benefits of which I'd like to see Tanganga reap too.

 

[ryuzakiluke100]

There's also a pecking order for defenders.... Tanganga (despite his baptism by fire against Liverpool last season) is also very low down that.

Tbh, there's so little to the point being debated here I'm not sure it's really worth the subsequent essays on either part.

As I started off saying, unless Tanganga can cement regular football for himself next year by virtue of whatever game-time he is afforded this year; I'd like to see him go on loan and get a full season of starts under his belt somewhere.

On the flipside, hypothetically, if you don't think playing well here this season would have earned more game-time as the fixtures stacked up then let's just agree to disagree. Ultimately it doesn't matter to me though, because I prefer he that he is at Norwich right now anyway..... The benefits of which I'd like to see Tanganga reap too.

My point is Skipp wouldn't get that much gametime in the first place to prove himself; while with Tanganga, he's had earned Mourinho trust. He was used against Chelsea in League Cup before getting sidelined. He would have guaranteed minutes in those previous EL games to prove himself if not for the injury.

Like many things in life, time is the ultimate judge. Thanks for the discussion.

 

[Totti]

 

[josh_spurs]

He was super tonight. Shit opponents but looked sharp.