Jose Mourinho

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Raumdeuterz said:
Meh. Maybe. Can't bring myself to care about it much, it was the carabao cup + I had zero faith before we sacked him so not gonna turn around and act like it would've changed things. Jose either has full support and his team is a rock or his team is in freefall and we were experiencing the latter.
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You just know he's going to win this conference with Roma and we'll forever be the club he never won a trophy with. Just another excuse for the cunts to dig at as with.
 

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Mourinho 'sucked the culture' out of Tottenham but is leading Roma revolution​

Jose Mourinho 'sucked the culture' out of Tottenham but is leading Roma revolution​

A year ago, Jose Mourinho was expected to take Tottenham Hotspur back into the top four and win trophies at the club, but instead, he is now achieving such feats at Roma



By
Charlie Parker-Turner
  • 08:00, 19 Apr 2022
Jose Mourinho’s two-year spell at Tottenham Hotspur certainly didn’t pan out how the ‘Chosen One’ would have hoped, but he is enjoying plenty of success in Roma.
After an underwhelming spell at Manchester United, Spurs offered Mourinho the opportunity to regain his status as one of the best managers in the world. However, the task at North London was too big for even the three-time Premier League winner.
In his first campaign at the club he could only manage a sixth-place finish, though there were signs of potential and, given his reputation, Mourinho was still trusted to take Spurs back to the very top. But that all changed very quickly in the following campaign.

Days before the EFL Cup Final, which offered Tottenham the chance to end their trophy drought, Mourinho was sacked. The team picked up just two points from three league fixtures prior to his dismissal, and were knocked out of the Europa League by Dinamo Zagreb in a devastating blow to their season.

The Athletic revealed that players had become bored of Mourinho’s training session and felt that there was too much work on defending the opposition of the week rather than focusing on attacking tactics. In the end, only Harry Kane was loyal to the former Chelsea boss – with even those higher up at the club growing unhappy with the manager, especially due to how he would openly critique members of the squad to the media.


They were told by one source: “He has sucked the culture out of the club and destroyed what Spurs have stood for for years.” But since the 59-year-old’s departure, Spurs remain – frankly – success-less, with the appointment of Antonio Conte giving the club the best possible opportunity to restore their status as title contenders next season.

On the other hand, Mourinho is thriving in his new job in the Serie A with Roma. The Portuguese boss was given plenty of spending power in the summer transfer windows, and the club is now reaping the benefits.

Rui Patricio was signed from Wolves, Eldor Shomurodov arrived from Genoa and Matias Vina was signed from Brazilian side Palmeiras. But Mourinho’s marquee signing was Tammy Abraham, purchased from former side Chelsea and giving the Englishman the chance to show why he deserved regular football under Thomas Tuchel at Stamford Bridge.

Abraham has scored 15 goals and assisted three in 31 league appearances for Roma, becoming a fan’s favourite along the way. And after three seasons of finishing outside of the top four (6th, 5th, 7th), the club are now on the cusp of returning to the Champions League - sitting in fifth place and six points behind fourth-placed Juventus, which can be closed to three if they win their game in hand.

The club are also in the semi-finals of the Europa Conference League and takes on Leicester City later this month, and if they can pass past the Premier League opposition then a final against Feyenoord/Marseille is a great opportunity for Mourinho to add another winner’s medal to his collection.
 
Mampi said:
Never liked the guy, never wanted him at the club, though was a part of me watching his success elsewhere that was a little envious.
Levy scratched his Mourinho itch and drew blood - but maybe that's not the whole story.

Honestly I think he came to the club at possibly the worst time for any managerial appointment I remember. We weren't an optimistic team on the rise, we had been shocking for a long time in the league and added to that the Champions League final defeat massively worked against us - but mentally the team and our fans thought we were better than we were. We had players that had played to a really high level before that were no longer at that level, and we as supporters also had to slowly accept that and move on from them.
He inherited a squad he liked the look of, like a lot of fans - based on previous levels and performances. But we all know what happened and Mourinho had to handle that 'painful' transition.
Players like Rose, Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Aurier, Winks, Sissoko, Lo Celso, Dele, Ndombele - at the time probably hard if not impossible to axe them all.
At the time I can understand reasons for trying to persevere with most of those names.

Then Covid. It's hard to say what difference fans and regular fixture scheduling could have had - but I don't think all our results would have been the same in a non Covid parallel universe.

The wrong man at the wrong time for me. Don't think there has ever been a right time for Mourinho at Spurs either, but I do think he has done a decent job at Roma. Problem he has now is that people look at his CV (like him or not) and will say that he should be exceeding expectations of the club. Maybe getting Roma top 4, winning a cup or 2 - because that's the standard he has set himself. Doesn't mean he hasn't done a decent job that most managers would be pretty happy with, and kind of proves his coaching & tactical methods are still relevant in the modern Italian game at least.

As for the cup final.. the most believable reason I have heard is that Levy had a massive cup win bonus for him in his contract, and a scaling contract termination fee based on current league position. So the timing possibly saved us tens of millions. He had to go really, and for Levy to find the most financially viable way to get rid of him is very believable - probably hoping Mason could do a Di Matteo style job where it's on the players to win.. but that doesn't account for Winks getting 90 minutes or Lucas / Lo Celso starting ahead of Bale for example.

A shite era I wish never happened - though I would also concede that very few (if any) managers would have been successful with us during that period of time.
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Very well thought out and balanced post......................... it will never catch on! :)
 
Mrs Perryman said:
Very well thought out and balanced post......................... it will never catch on! :)
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Damn right it shouldn’t.

I have no shame in saying that I was virulently anti-Jose before, during and after and my stance is that WE DO NOT NEGOTIATE WITH TERRORISTS!

If it was up to me the likes of Graham, Santini, Mourinho and Nuno would be on those “10 most wanted” lists. Their brand of football is a direct threat to my mental health and to the wider peace and security in the Lea Valley region.
 
Mampi said:
Never liked the guy, never wanted him at the club, though was a part of me watching his success elsewhere that was a little envious.
Levy scratched his Mourinho itch and drew blood - but maybe that's not the whole story.

Honestly I think he came to the club at possibly the worst time for any managerial appointment I remember. We weren't an optimistic team on the rise, we had been shocking for a long time in the league and added to that the Champions League final defeat massively worked against us - but mentally the team and our fans thought we were better than we were. We had players that had played to a really high level before that were no longer at that level, and we as supporters also had to slowly accept that and move on from them.
He inherited a squad he liked the look of, like a lot of fans - based on previous levels and performances. But we all know what happened and Mourinho had to handle that 'painful' transition.
Players like Rose, Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Aurier, Winks, Sissoko, Lo Celso, Dele, Ndombele - at the time probably hard if not impossible to axe them all.
At the time I can understand reasons for trying to persevere with most of those names.

Then Covid. It's hard to say what difference fans and regular fixture scheduling could have had - but I don't think all our results would have been the same in a non Covid parallel universe.

The wrong man at the wrong time for me. Don't think there has ever been a right time for Mourinho at Spurs either, but I do think he has done a decent job at Roma. Problem he has now is that people look at his CV (like him or not) and will say that he should be exceeding expectations of the club. Maybe getting Roma top 4, winning a cup or 2 - because that's the standard he has set himself. Doesn't mean he hasn't done a decent job that most managers would be pretty happy with, and kind of proves his coaching & tactical methods are still relevant in the modern Italian game at least.

As for the cup final.. the most believable reason I have heard is that Levy had a massive cup win bonus for him in his contract, and a scaling contract termination fee based on current league position. So the timing possibly saved us tens of millions. He had to go really, and for Levy to find the most financially viable way to get rid of him is very believable - probably hoping Mason could do a Di Matteo style job where it's on the players to win.. but that doesn't account for Winks getting 90 minutes or Lucas / Lo Celso starting ahead of Bale for example.

A shite era I wish never happened - though I would also concede that very few (if any) managers would have been successful with us during that period of time.
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Many excellent points. I think one thing that gets looked over is just how close we were to a very different outcome. We were top of the league at one point, and just a few near misses against Liverpool from actually extending that lead.

We finished the season 5 points behind 4th, and our GD was the 4th best in the league. We scored as many as Liverpool. Things could have turned out very differently with just a bit of luck.

If Levy had bought Skirniar for 40m instead of Rodon for 10 (and extra 30m outlay) we probably would have those 5 additional points to get us top 4. Maybe Mourinho wouldn't have gone full toxic cunt mode. Maybe win that bloody carabao cup with Skriniar instead of Sanchez the perpetually drunk CB.

I still think Mourinho has the best tactical mind in football, but he was fucked in the head by his tenure at RM, United etc. his extreme negative tactics after the West Ham 3-3 ruined everything.
 
KaneIsAble said:
Many excellent points. I think one thing that gets looked over is just how close we were to a very different outcome. We were top of the league at one point, and just a few near misses against Liverpool from actually extending that lead.

We finished the season 5 points behind 4th, and our GD was the 4th best in the league. We scored as many as Liverpool. Things could have turned out very differently with just a bit of luck.

If Levy had bought Skirniar for 40m instead of Rodon for 10 (and extra 30m outlay) we probably would have those 5 additional points to get us top 4. Maybe Mourinho wouldn't have gone full toxic cunt mode. Maybe win that bloody carabao cup with Skriniar instead of Sanchez the perpetually drunk CB.

I still think Mourinho has the best tactical mind in football, but he was fucked in the head by his tenure at RM, United etc. his extreme negative tactics after the West Ham 3-3 ruined everything.
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20/21 until Mourinho's sacking.
20-21.png


That first defeat against Liverpool changed something I have seen several times before. One of the most notable being an away defeat at Burnley in 18/19. It's like we mentally collapse with what appears to me a petulant "it's not fair" kind of attitude which we really struggle to recover from.
3 wins from our next 12 games after 7 in our previous 12 - but the football was also pretty damn bad.

I actually think Mourinho has a similar petulant attitude as a terrible loser. People say "show me a good loser and I will show you a loser" because it easily fits a narrative of 'losers lose' - that's not what I saw from the Liverpool side that lost the Champions League final the year before us. They were driven to win it the next season.. the rest is history.

It's an attitude thing. I wouldn't go as far as to say he has 'the best tactical mind in football' - but he clearly understands the game and can probably analyse tactically why we win or lose to a level more accurate than most managers could. Perhaps he can instruct exactly what should be done to beat opponents too - but without the mental application of the players it's useless.
That for me is Mourinho's weakness, and it's a huge one.

On reflection looking at the poor results above - there were some hard games. Liverpool, City, West Ham, Woolwich away - Liverpool, Chelsea, United at home. Games we don't really expect to win, but also don't expect to lose all of them.

Had we got results away to Brighton, West Ham, Newcastle - maybe he wouldn't have been sacked but we were awful to watch. I have never been so disinterested in any Tottenham side than Mourinho's. Honestly I started to stop caring about football and wasn't too bothered that Covid prevented me going to games because I didn't really want to sit through that.

So yeah I will agree we were possibly close to a very different outcome, but I far prefer watching us play now than I did under Mourinho. (Will always respect that 1-6 win at Old Trafford too)
 
Mampi said:
20/21 until Mourinho's sacking.
20-21.png


That first defeat against Liverpool changed something I have seen several times before. One of the most notable being an away defeat at Burnley in 18/19. It's like we mentally collapse with what appears to me a petulant "it's not fair" kind of attitude which we really struggle to recover from.
3 wins from our next 12 games after 7 in our previous 12 - but the football was also pretty damn bad.

I actually think Mourinho has a similar petulant attitude as a terrible loser. People say "show me a good loser and I will show you a loser" because it easily fits a narrative of 'losers lose' - that's not what I saw from the Liverpool side that lost the Champions League final the year before us. They were driven to win it the next season.. the rest is history.

It's an attitude thing. I wouldn't go as far as to say he has 'the best tactical mind in football' - but he clearly understands the game and can probably analyse tactically why we win or lose to a level more accurate than most managers could. Perhaps he can instruct exactly what should be done to beat opponents too - but without the mental application of the players it's useless.
That for me is Mourinho's weakness, and it's a huge one.

On reflection looking at the poor results above - there were some hard games. Liverpool, City, West Ham, Woolwich away - Liverpool, Chelsea, United at home. Games we don't really expect to win, but also don't expect to lose all of them.

Had we got results away to Brighton, West Ham, Newcastle - maybe he wouldn't have been sacked but we were awful to watch. I have never been so disinterested in any Tottenham side than Mourinho's. Honestly I started to stop caring about football and wasn't too bothered that Covid prevented me going to games because I didn't really want to sit through that.

So yeah I will agree we were possibly close to a very different outcome, but I far prefer watching us play now than I did under Mourinho. (Will always respect that 1-6 win at Old Trafford too)
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Agree on all points, but I think we were decent to watch for the first half that second season. Not 90 mins of fun but some very memorable games. In my alternate reality we continue like that for a few years under Mourinho, and maybe win something.

The second half of the season definitely was torture. I recently watched the highlights of a couple of those crucial games and my god we were slow, lazy, disorganised, weak for practically every goal conceded. Just pure shit.

Toby in particular looked like a fat old version of Luke Shaw.
 
Has he become a good manager again? I hope it happens

Having spent a large amount of time disliking him, mainly for his association with Chelski amongst other things, I now find myself rooting for him. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he proved all these fairweather journalists wrong and rediscovered his mojo.

Probably won't happen- looks like the modern game has passed him by - but I'd be happy if he won a major title in Italy.
 
Fazz said:
Has he become a good manager again? I hope it happens

Having spent a large amount of time disliking him, mainly for his association with Chelski amongst other things, I now find myself rooting for him. I'd be pleasantly surprised if he proved all these fairweather journalists wrong and rediscovered his mojo.

Probably won't happen- looks like the modern game has passed him by - but I'd be happy if he won a major title in Italy.
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Major title may be too much to ask. But he is seemingly turning Roma into a competitive team again at the very least.

They looked in dire straights around January, but he got rid of Sacramento as his assistant and since then they have only lost like 2 games.

Makes you wonder what would have happened if he sacked Joao while with us and got another assistant in to get the good cop - bad cop thing to actually work.
 
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