Mauricio Pochettino

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Will always have a soft spot for Poch.

Time will tell if he is the real deal or not. In a strange way, reaching the CL final propelled both Spurs and Poch into the international limelight, and maybe the hype over his managerial skills came too early for him.

I can say that here in Sydney, people with no connection to Spurs were speaking of him in glowing terms. Unheard of prior to the Ajax win.

Getting to the CL final was massive for both. All of a sudden Poch was being mentioned in regard to any top notch job.

I will always treasure the magic ride we went on, but am not sure if Poch will reach the "elite" level. I wish him well.
 
My view on Pochettino and PSG. Not the right fit. Not saying he won't achieve a modicum of success but I think both stand for different things.

Winning the Ligue would mean little. Mbappe, Neymar and co. Is 2nd acceptable?

Pochettino will and should be judged on how PSG perform in the CL - the acid test, and I mean over the next 3 years.

I would be staggered if they won it during that period but even more than us, during Pochettino's time they really do have the talent.

Good manager but not Great as yet. Think I have said similar aboit one of our players although I used very good for said player.
 
I think it would be the greatest story in football if Poch got sacked by PSG for not winning the league or CL, comes back to us and we win something next season.

For all that's gone on and as much as Pochs Bank balance won't care what's happened with Spurs and him where he's gone, he will have massive regrets and hurt inside about not winning anything with us and I don't think anything he wins with PSG would match the feeling of winning something with us.

Never gonna happen but we can all dream I guess...
 
Lilywhite9 said:
I think it would be the greatest story in football if Poch got sacked by PSG for not winning the league or CL, comes back to us and we win something next season.

For all that's gone on and as much as Pochs Bank balance won't care what's happened with Spurs and him where he's gone, he will have massive regrets and hurt inside about not winning anything with us and I don't think anything he wins with PSG would match the feeling of winning something with us.

Never gonna happen but we can all dream I guess...
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No
Nono
Nonononono

Hell no.

Poch was sacked rightfully by Spurs.
Under him we were playing as bad as we are now, maybe even worse. Why would one want him back after he has flopped in one-team-league now?!?

Despite all positive he done with us, in the end it was very toxic all around. He brought us up but dragged us back down as well... He oversaw the club in the spell where for years we signed exclusively hopeless players. Ffs he was CB in his career and during his time Sanchez was made our record signing (!!)

We absolutely have to sack Mou asap and make clearance sale in the squad. But after that, let's bring in a manager with whom we could hope to reach new highs. Not lovable loser who keeps talking about "being brave, playing well and how trophies build egos" and failed to win anything despite having prime Dembele, Walker, Jan, Toby, Dose, Eriksen in the side.

I would not be against him coaching us once again. But before now and then he as a manager has to learn a lot. And we as a club have to develop as well - to build up scouting network, hire capable DoF etc.

Right now it would be a dumpster fire if he was to return.
 
Ok so if Poch doesn’t win the league, he’s a massive bottler.
If he wins it, it doesn’t mean much. :deledoubt:

I mean yeah Ligue 1 might be dominated by one side but a league title is still a league title. A UCL win is pretty much difficult for every manager out there, having great players at disposal doesn’t guarantee success. Look at Barcelona, look at Man City.
 
theromanianjackass said:
Ok so if Poch doesn’t win the league, he’s a massive bottler.
If he wins it, it doesn’t mean much. :deledoubt:

I mean yeah Ligue 1 might be dominated by one side but I don’t hear people say the same about Bayern for example. A league title is still a league title. A UCL win is pretty much difficult for every manager out there, having great players at disposal doesn’t guarantee success. Look at Barcelona, look at Man City.
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Agree.
 
Vancat said:
Spurs is the best place for him, where as long as his players are pressing hard on the pitch and chase everything that moves he would already get applaud , results doesn't matter. PSG is different, winning the league is an absolute bottom line , there is no excuse to not win
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Yea, thing is - I know that and you know that.

Poch himself and media at some point at least seemed to conclude that he had found the magic formula and everything he touches turns to gold.

So he had 2 strategic options when he was (deservedly) sacked by Spurs:
A: Admit that you have not won anything yet, you need to learn and improve as a manager. Go find a club where, as you put it, results don't matter in the short run. Where you can build a squad and also develop further as manager and once you have actually managed to assemble a squad and helped them actually cross the line and win something - and then move on.
B: Ignore the obvious shortcomings, feed your own ego, assume you are already established super-coach. Then find a team where just by it's position you are almost granted to get titles (PSG, Bayern, Juve, Ajax), take over, win titles and after that use those titles as credentials that you as manager have really made it in the highest possible level for future career.

He chose option B. I am not saying which of them was right or wrong, better or worse. But this is path he chose. And if titles don't follow, he will crash and burn and is back to where he was when he took over Soton. Though he is not old, he has time to repeat this cycle even if he fails in PSG. I just hope that he can be wiser and learn from his mistakes, unlike his idol Bielsa who is 65 and has won absolutely nothing with his absolutist views.
 
I have no problem with Poch coming back to Spurs one day. In fact, I would welcome it.

But I think it would be a mistake to come back so soon after leaving. Because majority if not all of the things that caused him to get fired the first time around are still in place. Just look at what happened to Jardim when he came back to Monaco 4 months after being fired.

It's better to put some distance between runs at the same club. Let the players be shifted out. Shake up the youth and recruitment departments etc.

If Poch comes back in 4-5 years from now I will welcome him with open arms.
 
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theromanianjackass said:
Ok so if Poch doesn’t win the league, he’s a massive bottler.
If he wins it, it doesn’t mean much. :deledoubt:

I mean yeah Ligue 1 might be dominated by one side but a league title is still a league title. A UCL win is pretty much difficult for every manager out there, having great players at disposal doesn’t guarantee success. Look at Barcelona, look at Man City.
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Nope -
- if he wins, he can say that he has got league title in 5th biggest league in Europe
- if he fails to win it - then he fails to deliver title for the uttely dominating side

It is not fully lose-lose in that sense. BUT I would say that not winning has bigger downside than winning has an upside.
 
ShutUpPatrik said:
I have no problem with Poch coming back to Spurs one day. In fact, I would welcome it.

But I think it would be a mistake to come back so soon after leaving. Because majority if not all of the things that caused him to get fired the first time around are still in place. Just look at what happened to Jardim when he came back to Monaco 4 months after being fired.

It's better to put some distance between runs at the same club. Let the players be shifted out. Shake up the youth and recruitment departments etc.

If Poch comes back in 4-5 years from now I will welcome him with open arms.
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Basically same thing I said about his returning from the club side :thumbup:

But I would add that in order to put our faith in him again in the future, there would also has to be proof of progress he has made as a manager. Meaning we should not just offer him the job without conditions. But if he gets some more experience and proves his worth elsewhere - then by all means it would be deserved (but not gifted).
 
theromanianjackass said:
I still think PSG will win it. They’re only 3 points behind with 8 games left to play. I don’t see Lille being able to cope with the pressure.
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It's a proper title race, with 4 teams separated by just 5pts. So every single week there is potential for these teams to swap positions. It also will therefore feed the knee jerkers with all the necessary narratives they can choose from.

I think(???) PSG were in 5th when he took over, albeit just a handful of points (as they are now) from the top. Yes, PSG are by far the wealthiest club in that league, not a single opponent comes close to their wealth resources, but clearly, all wasn't well this year as they weren't their customary 10pts clear a Christmas!

I'm not following the league at all this year, so my interpretations are made purely from what I'm reading in the media rather than seeing anything first hand. But even for PSG to sack a coach midseason was an exceptional move for them to make.

From what I'm reading the feeling is Monaco is the team that currently look the strongest, they are certainly on the best run of form out of that group of 4, again albeit with minimal points advantage. French media have had a hard-on for Kovac (yet another Red Bull management product) since he beat PSG when Tuchel was managing. Another excellent Coach who was baited by more knee-jerking during his last job at Bayern despite being the only coach to win back to back doubles in Germany for 15yrs!

With all of their direct competitors out of Europe (with them still in CL) that hands the marginal gains to their opponents. It will be a proper nail-biting final run to the line. When it's this close it's so hard to tell what way it will go.
 
I still have a soft spot for Poch, so if he wins some trophies, I will be happy for him.

Even without a bunch of Covid and injury issues, they don't really have a good enough midfield to be expected to get past Bayern or win the CL. They are going to have to shithouse it, I think.

I have read some comments from Bielsa and Kehrer lately, and really the message I am getting is that Poch's biggest strength is his man-management. From a tactical POV, I don't think he is held in high regard. I know it's only one game, I know there are mitigating circumstances, but they looked like a team of strangers at the weekend.
 
Five said:
I still have a soft spot for Poch, so if he wins some trophies, I will be happy for him.

Even without a bunch of Covid and injury issues, they don't really have a good enough midfield to be expected to get past Bayern or win the CL. They are going to have to shithouse it, I think.

I have read some comments from Bielsa and Kehrer lately, and really the message I am getting is that Poch's biggest strength is his man-management. From a tactical POV, I don't think he is held in high regard. I know it's only one game, I know there are mitigating circumstances, but they looked like a team of strangers at the weekend.
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I think most on here can agree that Poch is not the sharpest tactician. He has his philosophy and plan for how he wants to play football and would rather lose playing that way than adapt to it.

How many games did he wait until the 80th or so minute to make a sub when things weren't working for us?

And his man management skills are definitely going to be tested now that he is dealing with a whole different type of ego than the ones he had with us. And even with us it obviously faltered towards the end.
 
ShutUpPatrik said:
I think most on here can agree that Poch is not the sharpest tactician. He has his philosophy and plan for how he wants to play football and would rather lose playing that way than adapt to it.

How many games did he wait until the 80th or so minute to make a sub when things weren't working for us?

And his man management skills are definitely going to be tested now that he is dealing with a whole different type of ego than the ones he had with us. And even with us it obviously faltered towards the end.
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I'm not going to disagree with the tactics element, because for every game I can find to support his tactical ability was brilliant I'm sure that just as many can be found in support that he wasn't.

Most good progressive modern managers focus on their team and their strengths, they have a style and a way of playing that they stick to and they rarely deviate away from this. Many will play the same players every game if they don't have injuries or fixture congestion to juggle. Does this make them tactically inflexible? Conte and Klopp won the League by having a virtually fully fit team available every game, the fact they could pick pretty much the same team every week and played the same way (even making the same subs at the same time) doesn't make them any more or any less good tactically.

But for me, I've not seen a better and more diverse team tactically than us during our peak under Poch. We played a huge variety of formations (4-2-3-1, 4-4-2, 3-5-2, 4-1-4-1, 4-2-2-2 etc) he was constantly making tactical switches during a game, so saying he didn't make a sub until 80 mins don't wash with me, especially if he had us play with a back 3, then a back four during a game and didn't have to make a sub to do it! (This was why Dier was so important to him and to the team).

The only manager that has shown such diversity is the fella he replaced, Tuchel. When Tuchel was at Dortmund he was almost identical to Poch with their philosophies and both favoured their 4-2-3-1, with the players almost playing in exactly the same way position for position. But at PSG it was almost impossible to 2nd guess how PSG would play. Yes, like Poch their underlying philosophy was unchanged but tactically there was far more variation than for example Pep, Klopp who other than a few nuanced player tweaks (e.g Walker inverted or playing the last man) they played the same football in every single game regardless of who the oppo was.
 
ShutUpPatrik said:
I have no problem with Poch coming back to Spurs one day. In fact, I would welcome it.

But I think it would be a mistake to come back so soon after leaving. Because majority if not all of the things that caused him to get fired the first time around are still in place. Just look at what happened to Jardim when he came back to Monaco 4 months after being fired.

It's better to put some distance between runs at the same club. Let the players be shifted out. Shake up the youth and recruitment departments etc.

If Poch comes back in 4-5 years from now I will welcome him with open arms.
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This is exactly how I feel. If (fingers crossed) Mourinho is gone in June and we had a straight choice between Nagelsmann and Poch then it'd be a no-brainer for me to go for Nagelsmann. We need to try something fresh and lord knows 6 months with PSG, especially if he got sacked, is nowhere near enough time away before any return.
 
Thin Lilywhite Duke said:
This is exactly how I feel. If (fingers crossed) Mourinho is gone in June and we had a straight choice between Nagelsmann and Poch then it'd be a no-brainer for me to go for Nagelsmann. We need to try something fresh and lord knows 6 months with PSG, especially if he got sacked, is nowhere near enough time away before any return.
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If Mourinho is gone in the summer we need to get someone new in. Someone that can start a new project. I am not as sold on Nagelsmann as the rest on here but it needs to be someone new.

Poch should return in 4 years or so when the project has gotten further in its cycle. Or maybe even later to start a new project after that one.

It's definitely good to get some degrees of separation going.
 
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