True but (and I'm guessing here) one project would cost £15-20m and the other £40-50m.
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I think from open play with that back five, bare in mind their inexperience at this level, they are more than fine.
Let's have a look at those fixtures.
Woolwich. Only all played in the away fixture. Woolwich scored from an own goal and a penalty... Can't remember any other problems they caused us outside of Maddison being dispossessed by Gabriel Jesus in the first half.
Liverpool... At home against 9 men granted, but they scored from a set piece...
Man Utd at home. Kept a clean sheet... Away from home, did concede twice. Two good goals to be fair. Nothing too worrying defensively. Was VDVs first league game back after 2 and a half months out.
Chelsea, bit harsh to include this one. We hadn't conceded a goal with that back five on the pitch... Romero got sent off, they scored. And up until van de Ven and Udogie went off, we still hadn't conceded another...
Now Newcastle WAS a disaster. But we only conceded two goals with that back five on the pitch.
So all in all, from open play in those fixtures we conceded a grand total of 4 goals with that back five on the pitch... 5 if you include the own goal.
Regarding set pieces
View: https://x.com/yiddogusdos/status/1793998175096930585?t=iGKXjsLFM1WqeEeloDMVNw&s=19
Not disagreeing but a lot of our issues don’t come from our defenders it comes from our midfield and attack. Liverpool who play a high line when they had Mane where a nightmare to attack against, for a high line defence the first defender is the attackers who counter press and midfielders who block in behind.
We don’t press well enough, our attackers don’t hold the ball well enough so we lose the ball to often and don’t cut the space quick enough when we do. That is not Romero, VDV or Porro’s fault. We could have prime Maldini and still suffer. The way we play our defence will be fixed with attackers and midfielders that retain possessions better and press better.
This is probably why we are linked to Gallagher, Ederson for midfielder and need attackers that can link and hold better. Buying defenders won’t fix our defence.
Or a cunt off.Will say thisKlaus nicoclaesen
Starks
This place could really use a fucking transfer rumour to talk about.
I think this is what Ange fundamentally means when he gets across that there are more important things than simply coaching set pieces.
If we get better at doing the things that matter such as pressing, retaining possession better etc then we simply limit the amount of set pieces we concede in the first place.
There's method to the madness, even if some people can't grasp that way of thinking. Once we've got that area nailed down through repititon and better recruitment, having designated set piece coaching sessions can be more of a priority.
Not sure if it's enough to judge our press with just data but I believe we had statistically the most effective press in the league this year. Passes per defensive action and chances from high turnovers etc.
Maybe someone has that data?
Fully agree on our attack coughing up the ball in dangerous situations though. We also need to get better with CMs rotating in behind when the FBs are forward.
Much more likely than a decent transfer rumour today
I hope not mate tbh. Not enough technical ability in there. Im with nicoclaesen think Sarr’ touch and passing is fine when he’s got a yard and facing forward. Get physical and press him back to goal and it starts to fall down a bit. We’ve even seen that this season in the number 8 when we’ve gone away and teams have got at us, played man for man with high energy and physicality and his touch and ball retention starts to fall down.
Taking the ball on the back foot and ball manipulation is key in that 6 position.
Bisoumma and Bentancur are really the only ones that can do it relatively consistently.
Which game did his touch and. ball retention fall apart?
I think Sarr can improve playing on the half turn but as that video of the Milan game showed, Sarr is plenty technical enough and will only get better.
Tbh the only teams that really pressed our #6 were City, Liverpool and Woolwich. Newcastle pressed our CBs then dropped back.
Identifying Attacking Overloads And Measuring Their Impact - StatsBomb | Data Champions
StatsBomb Senior Analyst Jaymes Monte uses StatsBomb 360 data to explore attacking overloads and which Premier League teams use them most.
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View: https://x.com/StatsBomb/status/1775478395968672184?t=5RG-XsBFSbid3BwUVZ4hvA&s=19
Also an interesting one from a defensive standpoint.
View: https://x.com/oilysailor/status/1776003380265050156?t=ArBZxI1_sHBiSh2EmdOpFg&s=19
I think whenever Soule is mentioned, it should be accompanied by this goal
View: https://x.com/DSportsAR/status/1771364619354878415?t=B7TmXGoNYuquzFG8GarsoA&s=19
Completely agree with all of this. My point with our back five wasn't to dig them out - to a man I think they're fantastic and we won't find a better player in any of those positions for years to come.
What I was trying to say was that despite those brilliant players we're still conceding far too many chances, which if anything makes me more worried, as it's indicative of structural or tactical problems which are harder to resolve than simply buying better players. Above all it requires flexibility from the manager which we've seen precious little of to date.
And when I say structurally I'm specifically talking the "double-inverted fullback playing as auxiliary #10s" system which - and I will die on this hill - will always leave us far too open defensively to compete at the top of this league. The teams across the board are too good, managers too tactically adept, and they will punish you for setting up this way.
One inverted - fine. There's a reason Pep does this and all the top managers copy him. Both fullbacks, in a 2-3? Bit more risky but OK. Both fullbacks, with both pushed right up alongside the #8s? Sorry but that's batshit.
Even if you buy the best pressing forwards in the game like Mane, and prime Casemiro at DM, we will always be too open defensively open like this. Might have worked for Celtic against St Mirren, won't work in the big leagues. Hopefully Agnes adjusts.
I'm guessing a lot of the big transfers will happen at the back end or after the Euros has finished, so we're all going to have to be patient this summer with comings and goings. It's likely to be a mental July.
Is he really that different to Kulusevski though?
Not sure he’s a touchline winger at all. Very talented but not sure he’s what we need or built for the prem
This feels pretty generous.
United home - yes we kept a clean sheet but they had plenty of chances and had racked up a good 1.5xG by half time. It was purely their terrible finishing that meant they didn't score.
Liverpool home - we were very open in that game let's be real, and really they scored two fair goals. Even against 10 men they looked dangerous and arguably the better side.
Chelsea - ultimately mate we conceded 4 goals to a shite Chelsea and allowed Nicolas fucking Jackson to get a hattrick on our home turf. Yes it took two of our CBs getting sent off to get there, but that's on them too, we can't just absolve them of responsibility cos they were stupid enough to get reds. Chelsea also looked very much in the game before the red cards and we were giving up chances far too easily.
Newcastle away was an absolute horror show. Sorry but that one can't be defended. And considering Udogie and VDV were some of the ones making the big mistakes when they were on the pitch I fail to see how if the first choice back 5 had finished the game the scoreline would have been any different.
Anyway we're going down a bit of a rabbit hole here. My point wasn't to dig out the back five, who I think are generally very good. It's that despite our back five we are still very open defensively at times which points to issues structurally.
Definitely not a touch line winger.
But he's someone who raises our technique level in offence by 10. Won't lose the ball alot (other than trying to create) and will always look forward.
I don't think he's someone we'll go for though tbh. I think Paratici has shown interest but if they're all on the same page, then you're right about the touchline winger aspect if that is what Ange wants his Spurs team to look like.
Wasn't their xG largely down to their offside chance that didn't get called offside (and would have subsequently been called back by VAR?), Fernandes or Rashford header I believe. I struggle to remember any other chances they had.
Plus, it was only the second time that back five had ever played together.
Again, not sure I remember anything Vicario had to contend with from open play.
Yeah we did... With Dier and Hojberg at centre back and Emerson at LB with 9 men.
Which has nothing to do with our back five.
Absolutely.
So it took us to game week 33 for our starting back five to all have an off game. It happens.
I reckon if we had a better offence, the scoreline would have been different and we don't concede 4 goals. Because that's the main issue.
We're open because we are set up to play high and press high. Which means if Son struggles to hold the ball up (Newcastle for example) or Johnson loses the ball or Kulusevski cuts inside and mispaldes a pass, the opponents are right on us. We're no more open than a Villa, City, Liverpool or even Woolwich.
Villa conceded the same amount of goals as us (despite us having much worse injury problems defensively) and Liverpool, City and Woolwich are simply better offensively than us so they see less turnovers and chance creation against them (as well as all being much better at defending set pieces).
Once weve got technically sufficient players in that front line and depth more in line with a team that wants to dominate the ball, we'll look less open. We'll still give up chances like every single top team does, but we'll limit them.
That's the next step. It's how every single Ange team has done things and it's how every one of the top team mentioned has got to where they are now. By improving the technical quality to suit the managers needs and everyone singing from the same hymn sheet.
I mean the number that should jump out to you here is the 145 conceded, the 5th highest in the league. That simply has to improve if we're to stop giving away so many set piece goals.
Think the Milan game was a completely different game than a premier league game. Different tempo and if I remember he had Skipp playing square of him. He was fine that game but it wasn’t massively influential. Was a solid game imo.
Off the top of my head think Wolves away, Chelsea away, Everton away, Brighton away maybe even Forest away. could be wrong on some of them or missing some out but just remember when some of them games got more physical and a higher tempo his ball retention and ball manipulation started to fall down.
Teams were pressing Bisoumma at the start of the season but because he was so good at breaking the press and and taking players out and breaking lines that they let him have that space and started pressing in different areas. Think if you moved Sarr there, teams would start pressing that area again and you turn the ball over in that area it’s disaster.
I like Sarr but he’s an 8 imo and if we get Gallagher who I’m still not completely convinced on they’ll be playing in the same roll, sharing game time.