The Race for 4th

[Shadydan]

We don’t help ourselves as a football club I’m sorry. Prime example already recently. In the driving seat for 4th after working so hard to capitalise on Arsenals poor form, then comes the Brighton loss at home and now Woolwich in the driving seat. As Spursy as they come mate sorry.

We dropped points, oh no how dare we lol, that's nothing to with us being cursed, that football my friend.

This Spursy thing is just pure confirmation bias the moment when something unexpected happens on our club like lose games for example, everyone loses games they're expected to win, it's nothing new.

I remember when people were saying that the when the initial Conte talks broke down that it was 'Spursy'....we ended up with Conte 3 months later.

 

[Don Corleone]

We dropped points, oh no how dare we lol, that's nothing to with us being cursed, that football my friend.

This Spursy thing is just pure confirmation bias the moment when something unexpected happens on our club like lose games for example, everyone loses games they're expected to win, it's nothing new.

I remember when people were saying that the when the initial Conte talks broke down that it was 'Spursy'....we ended up with Conte 3 months later.

Have added more scenarios. We are “Spursy” mate and until we get the monkey off our back and start becoming successful, we will forever be branded it

 

[kolyid]

Paul Tierney won't be anti-spurs, he will just be absolute grade A dog shite like he always is whatever game he's reffing. Expect dodgy pens, ridiculous VAR cock-ups, missed red card fouls... the lot. He'll be as bad for them as he is us.

What the game will boil down to though, is Arse will have 11 men with fire pumping through their veins ready to put their life on the line, whereas we will inevitably have 3 or 4 who look like they've just got out of bed. Happens all too often now in big games against teams not called Man City.

Oooh and bonus points for us somehow managing to get ourselves in pole position after Anfield only to throw it away in pathetic fashion in the NLD. Read this script too many times before.

I agree about our team but I don’t think you’ve watched Woolwich matches. Their players don’t have fire pumping in their veins and quite frankly are frauds who wouldn’t even get in our team.

The problem is their last three matches have been against teams who don’t want us to succeed and are already on the beach and don’t care for results.

 

[Spaniel]

I wonder if it would be better to have a decent run in the EL rather than get knocked out in the 1st round of the CL. I just don't believe we'll be recruiting what we need in the summer. We've been let down by Levy/ENIC year after year. What's different about this year?

 

[Airfixx]

Disagree, personally think we are cursed as a club

How deep does your belief in the occult go? ...Any other aspects of life?

Name me a club that hypes their supporters up so much, yet fail to deliver and fail at the last hurdle like us?

Perhaps it would be better for your psyche if we were never in the mix at all....... ?

You will be pushed to find a club that has so many situations go against us. There’s a reason why the phrase “Spursy” is associated with us.

"Spursy" was just coined by our own fans to mean doing things the hard way.... You've consumed way too much Adrian Durham.

It’s not called Sunderlandy or Newcastly is it? I just feel we never catch a break as a club. I feel we are cursed.

Funny you should name 2 historically big clubs that have both been relegated numerous times over the last 20 years.

....I bet they'd have hated to have the last so-called "20 years of failure" (tm) that we've had as opposed to what they had to endure. :sarcasm:

 

[Airfixx]

We don’t help ourselves as a football club I’m sorry. Prime example already recently. In the driving seat for 4th after working so hard to capitalise on Arsenals poor form, then comes the Brighton loss at home and now Woolwich in the driving seat. As Spursy as they come mate sorry. Champions league final, handball and Spursy it up in the 1st minute ffs . Lasagna gate. 3rd in a 2 horse race. 10 point mind the gap Woolwich scenario. Woolwich winning the league at the lane. Nah mate, sorry this is a curse and Spursy as they come. Can count loads of other scenarios.

You seem to just throw certain phrases around without really understanding what they mean.

"Curse" and "Spursy" being 2 for starters.

 

[Shadydan]

Have added more scenarios. We are “Spursy” mate and until we get the monkey off our back and start becoming successful, we will forever be branded it

The narrative will never go it will just get shifted purely for low level banter, if we win a domestic trophy the narrative will be shifted that we haven't won a 'big' trophy or if we win a big trophy and miss out on it the following year then the Spursy thing will come up again.

Also success is relative, in 2005 if someone was to say to you that we'd qualify for the CL 5 times in the next 15 years you and plenty others would have seen that as successful, people only follow the trophy = success thing because modern day fans are brainwashed into thinking that's the be all and end all of football.

A few of our fans are so woe is me/glass half empty about our club, it's actually hilarious

 

[Don Corleone]

The narrative will never go it will just get shifted purely for low level banter, if we win a domestic trophy the narrative will be shifted that we haven't won a 'big' trophy or if we win a big trophy and miss out on it the following year then the Spursy thing will come up again.

Also success is relative, in 2005 if someone was to say to you that we'd qualify for the CL 5 times in the next 15 years you and plenty others would have seen that as successful, people only follow the trophy = success thing because modern day fans are brainwashed into thinking that's the be all and end all of football.

A few of our fans are so woe is me/glass half empty about our club, it's actually hilarious

Like i said bud, the club don’t help ourselves. We win trophies, we shove it back in their face. Spursy becomes no more. I’m sorry mate, but there have been far too many comical situations that make Spurs very unique. You can dress it up all you like, but the club put themselves in this situation and make us an easy target for banter time and time again. It’s just facts. Check any match thread on a Spurs forum. Spurs fans are never truly comfortable or confident in our club. Why is that? Because we Spursy it up so many times. I can guarantee that if Spurs made another final anytime soon, the vast majority of our fanbase would be pessimistic. Ask the question, why is that?

 

[Deuterz]

The narrative will never go it will just get shifted purely for low level banter, if we win a domestic trophy the narrative will be shifted that we haven't won a 'big' trophy or if we win a big trophy and miss out on it the following year then the Spursy thing will come up again.

Also success is relative, in 2005 if someone was to say to you that we'd qualify for the CL 5 times in the next 15 years you and plenty others would have seen that as successful, people only follow the trophy = success thing because modern day fans are brainwashed into thinking that's the be all and end all of football.

A few of our fans are so woe is me/glass half empty about our club, it's actually hilarious

My god this is such an embarrassing statement. Fans like you are legitimately the reason we get rinsed by rivals, the idea that trophies equating to success in football is some modern concept is so ludicrously false and ridiculous.

We haven't won a trophy in 15 years. Trophies are what all players & coaches strive for. It's why Harry Kane was desperate to leave in the summer, why we lost Bale, and why we'll lose more top players in the future unless we turn it around and become a club that wins stuff. Can't believe I actually have to tell another so called football 'fan' this.

 

[Airfixx]

My god this is such an embarrassing statement. Fans like you are legitimately the reason we get rinsed by rivals, the idea that trophies equating to success in football is some modern concept is so ludicrously false and ridiculous.

We haven't won a trophy in 15 years. Trophies are what all players & coaches strive for. It's why Harry Kane was desperate to leave in the summer, why we lost Bale, and why we'll lose more top players in the future unless we turn it around and become a club that wins stuff. Can't believe I actually have to tell another so called football 'fan' this.

Trophies (and glory) are absolutely what every fan aspires to, but the underlying subtext that every season amounts to being meaningless for the 95% of clubs that win nothing each year is BS.

 

[Deuterz]

Trophies (and glory) are absolutely what every fan aspires to, but the underlying subtext that every season amounts to being meaningless for the 95% of clubs that win nothing each year is BS.

I don't get how this is the subtext. I'd still support Spurs if someone told me we'd never win a trophy in my lifetime, and I'd still enjoy games. That doesn't mean I'm gonna play down the importance of winning cups for a team that aspires to be part of the 'elite' just because we're not very good at it.

That whole attitude screams 'well I never cared much anyway!!!' and it's cringeworthy. Yes you do want trophies, no you don't think it's some modern football fan craze, you just don't think we'll do it so you're making sure your own expectations are low to match that.

 

[Airfixx]

I don't get how this is the subtext.

Maybe, not in terms of your sentiment, but it sure as fuck is when you marry things up with the way certain posters cry, whinge, bitch, ridicule and generally conduct themselves.....

Ergo why it's only too common to see posters taken the piss out of for having pride in certain aspects of the last 20 years.

...Or perhaps you've never encountered the "20 years of failure" narrative?

I'd still support Spurs if someone told me we'd never win a trophy in my lifetime, and I'd still enjoy games.

More power to you.

This doesn't reflect the individual (and others) that you're rubbing shoulders with on the topic however...... Joyless fatalism and regularly flouncing declaring they're gonna jack it all in.

That doesn't mean I'm gonna play down the importance of winning cups for a team that aspires to be part of the 'elite' just because we're not very good at it.

That whole attitude screams 'well I never cared much anyway!!!' and it's cringeworthy. Yes you do want trophies, no you don't think it's some modern football fan craze, you just don't think we'll do it so you're making sure your own expectations are low to match that.

Whole lot of projecting going on here..... Who is this "you"?

.......You're not portraying what was said by either myself or Shadydan .

 

[Deuterz]

Maybe, not in terms of your sentiment, but it sure as fuck is when you marry things up with the way certain posters cry, whinge, bitch, ridicule and generally conduct themselves.....

Ergo why it's only too common to see posters taken the piss out of for having pride in certain aspects of the last 20 years.

...Or perhaps you've never encountered the "20 years of failure" narrative?



Whole lot of projecting going on here..... Who is this "you"?

.......You're not portraying what was said by either myself or Shadydan .

Yes, I absolutely am. The man has just said trophies = success is a modern fan thing, it's absolutely just some paper thin coping method. Of course trophies are success, it's what you play the games for, the silverware at the end of it!

And whether you like it or not, 20 years without trophies is 20 years of failure. You can enjoy the moments that come with it, you can still enjoy being a football fan, but the end result is objectively failing to do what all players & coaches dream of doing, and what they move to bigger clubs for.

 

[Don Corleone]

My god this is such an embarrassing statement. Fans like you are legitimately the reason we get rinsed by rivals, the idea that trophies equating to success in football is some modern concept is so ludicrously false and ridiculous.

We haven't won a trophy in 15 years. Trophies are what all players & coaches strive for. It's why Harry Kane was desperate to leave in the summer, why we lost Bale, and why we'll lose more top players in the future unless we turn it around and become a club that wins stuff. Can't believe I actually have to tell another so called football 'fan' this.

Its sad isn’t it. Spurs fans have become so starved of success, it’s become ok to be a failure of a football club. 1 league cup in 21 years is an absolute shambles for a club of our size

 

[JIMINHO]

We dropped points, oh no how dare we lol, that's nothing to with us being cursed, that football my friend.

This Spursy thing is just pure confirmation bias the moment when something unexpected happens on our club like lose games for example, everyone loses games they're expected to win, it's nothing new.

I remember when people were saying that the when the initial Conte talks broke down that it was 'Spursy'....we ended up with Conte 3 months later.

That’s one way of looking at it mate. The term Spursy is very real and it’s embedded in this club. Everyone knows it unfortunately.

 

[Matt1882]

Just for perspective, if we won our last 4 then this season would be the 5th best in our top flight history:

		P	W	D	L	F	A	GD	Pts	Pos	PPG	Pts
1	1960-61	42	31	4	7	115	55	60	66	1	2.31	87.8
2	2016-17	38	26	8	4	86	26	60	86	2	2.26	86
3	2017-18	38	23	8	7	74	36	38	77	3	2.03	77
4	1950-51	42	25	10	7	82	44	38	60	1	2.02	76.9
5	2021-22	38	23	4	11				73		1.92	73

It also means we'd have beaten possibly the best 2 teams in the world on their own patches.

That aside- is the above accounting for 2 points vs 3 points for a win?

 

[Shadydan]

Like i said bud, the club don’t help ourselves. We win trophies, we shove it back in their face. Spursy becomes no more. I’m sorry mate, but there have been far too many comical situations that make Spurs very unique. You can dress it up all you like, but the club put themselves in this situation and make us an easy target for banter time and time again. It’s just facts. Check any match thread on a Spurs forum. Spurs fans are never truly comfortable or confident in our club. Why is that? Because we Spursy it up so many times. I can guarantee that if Spurs made another final anytime soon, the vast majority of our fanbase would be pessimistic. Ask the question, why is that?

When we won the Carling Cup why wasn't the narrative shoved back in their faces then? Spursy or bottlers or the general piss taking of Spurs didn't just die down when we won a trophy it was just moved onto us not being able to qualify for the CL, we finished 11th that season by the way so it's not as if we overcame some form of mammoth landmark to dispel the myth, if you recall next season we started badly and Ramos was sacked, what you think rivals fans were taking their hats off to Spurs and respecting us despite being in the relegation zone just because we won a trophy the season before?

I don't think match threads are an indicator of much, you can view any match thread on any forum for other clubs, you will always get fans who think the world is caving in purely because they are living in the moment of pure emotion so raw feelings are always sensationalised,

Why would the fans be pessimistic about the team in a final? Because some of our fans lack belief and believe is some mysterious witchcraft and use words like cursed maybe? Obviously, our records in recent finals is poor I get that but I don’t see how this has anything to do with being cursed, what you’re suggesting is that there’s a hex on our club which is just nonsense, sorry.

 

[Airfixx]

Yes, I absolutely am. The man has just said trophies = success is a modern fan thing, it's absolutely just some paper thin coping method. Of course trophies are success, it's what you play the games for, the silverware at the end of it!

Given the first half of the para that has you riled:

"success is relative, in 2005 if someone was to say to you that we'd qualify for the CL 5 times in the next 15 years you and plenty others would have seen that as successful"

I think there's a degree of nuance to the comments that you're not so keen to engage with.

And whether you like it or not, 20 years without trophies is 20 years of failure.

Meh...... (See below)

You can enjoy the moments that come with it, you can still enjoy being a football fan, but the end result is objectively failing to do what all players & coaches dream of doing, and what they move to bigger clubs for.

This really is not the sentiment that underpins the manner with which that phrase (nay, meme!) is typically wielded...... It's most commonly used as a weapon against us by individuals (our 'own') that believe in the notion of "winning the transfer window" and harbour jealousy for clubs like Everton, West Ham & Villa who - IRONY ALERT!!! - have trophy drouts that run for even longer than ours(!).

Yes, in the most stark, dogmatic and black and white terms every team in the pryramid that doesn't win a top tier trophy this season (all 70/71 of them!) will have "failed", but you'll find a plethora of fans up and down the country that won't feel like their clubs failed this season regardless.

Promotion
Avoiding relegation
Top 4
Top 7
Progression up their respective leagues
Finishing high enough to earn enough money/kudos to keep cherished players.
...And on.

Your suggestion/implication that the sentiment of such individuals is part of the reason they didn't rack up a EPL or CL trophy season after season is bogus... Particularly given the stranglehold that petro-dollars have had on the PL over the last 20 years.

 

[Airfixx]

That’s one way of looking at it mate. The term Spursy is very real and it’s embedded in this club. Everyone knows it unfortunately.

Yes; and it's been bastardised to mean something else thanks to oppo fans, snarky journo's and fans of our own that are perfectly content to help stoke the agenda of the afformentioned that revel in our struggles and shortcomings.

 

[JIMINHO]

Its sad isn’t it. Spurs fans have become so starved of success, it’s become ok to be a failure of a football club. 1 league cup in 21 years is an absolute shambles for a club of our size

Completely agree with this statement. I hear a lot of fans saying that top 4 would be considered a successful season and at the half way point, I’d agree. But overall, we need to be aiming to win every tournament we enter. Who wouldn‘t want to be in Liverpools position right now and who can fault their success. Every decision in terms of managerial appointment, player signings and style of play are faultless. Hard to believe we were Klopp’s first match. The two clubs have gone on two very different directions since then.

Will always be a Spurs fan though and it will make that next trophy all the more sweeter. I just hope I haven’t lost all my hair by then……