Tim Sherwood

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@ Lister Lister
Team from west ham to now has changed quite a bit.

We started off with two attacking mids in midfield vs west ham and with two natural wingers, we also came out very strong and fast in that game, but fell away quite drastically towards the end.

Next games against soton and stoke we started much slower and finished the game much stronger, however we were still a bit gung-ho.

Against UTD we started with capoue in the midfield and looked to sit back, let utd do all the work and hit them on the counter.

The Woolwich game (wrongly imo) he played without a recognised destroyer in midfield and it cost us, not playing defensive or attacking and were picked apart by a very good passing Woolwich side. Oh and roses brain fart probably didn't help
 
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Im going to state the obvious because some fans seem to forget where we are at?
Tims appointment was appropriate for the moment. He has done, better than expected. His first game against WHU could have gone better and FA Cup Vs Woolwich, there is no shame. In the league he has marched us on an unbeaten run, that has seen us beat UTD at OT (no one expected that).
At first, why Tim? Now, he should better - its all a nonsense.
History tells us how good a manager was. I hope he can show the same form in the EL as he has in the PL. I feel he was just unlucky in our domestic trophies but we'll march on.
 
LillyCockerels said:
Learning on the job it seems, a trait that sadly AVB never possessed
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You do feel that, TS will learn and progress as a capable manager. AVB was capable to learn but unfortunately he was too involved with the detail and forgot that players can take some responsibility in their actions on a football pitch Players need some guidance but also need some flexibility. TS, allows player just that. However, I have to say, when the going gets tough, TS will need to get players concentrating on their jobs first. Good teams will expose any weakness. Every player needs to step up to the front line and be counted when the bigger teams/matches present themselves.
 
A lot will depend, re EL, on our Prem position.

It'sd be pointless sacrificing the EL in order to qualify for it again through the Lge.

I only want us to qualify for the EL this season through winning it, otherwise I'm quite happy finishing 7th and making the EL semi-finals at least, so we don't have to deal with its problems next season.

I'm assuming in this analysis ENIC are continuing their book balancing tactics.

Ideally, we get a new owner in tomorrow, buy some players in the window, starting on Wednesday, and give it a real go on both fronts.
 
LillyCockerels said:
@ Lister Lister
Team from west ham to now has changed quite a bit.

We started off with two attacking mids in midfield vs west ham and with two natural wingers, we also came out very strong and fast in that game, but fell away quite drastically towards the end.

Next games against soton and stoke we started much slower and finished the game much stronger, however we were still a bit gung-ho.

Against UTD we started with capoue in the midfield and looked to sit back, let utd do all the work and hit them on the counter.

The Woolwich game (wrongly imo) he played without a recognised destroyer in midfield and it cost us, not playing defensive or attacking and were picked apart by a very good passing Woolwich side. Oh and roses brain fart probably didn't help
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The team may have changed, but the set up and attitude hasnt. I think the differences you describe are down to the opposition more than any changes by Sherwood.

Every game, 442 with one winger and one playmaker. Perhaps too adventurous, wide open at the back, and relying on Ade to tie it all together.
 
MrS said:
You do feel that, TS will learn and progress as a capable manager. AVB was capable to learn but unfortunately he was too involved with the detail and forgot that players can take some responsibility in their actions on a football pitch Players need some guidance but also need some flexibility. TS, allows player just that. However, I have to say, when the going gets tough, TS will need to get players concentrating on their jobs first. Good teams will expose any weakness. Every player needs to step up to the front line and be counted when the bigger teams/matches present themselves.
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I havent seen anything to suggest he is learning, it seems to me he is still going about it the way he did against West Ham. Most noticable change was bringing in Capoue, which balanced things a lot better - but then at the weekend he went with no Capoue and nothing else to compensate defensively.

I want him to learn, and I hope to hell he does and fast - I hope in a few games time all this talk looks like folly - but Ive seen nothing so far to suggest that will happen...
 
Lister said:
The team may have changed, but the set up and attitude hasnt. I think the differences you describe are down to the opposition more than any changes by Sherwood.

Every game, 442 with one winger and one playmaker. Perhaps too adventurous, wide open at the back, and relying on Ade to tie it all together.
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Sure they may not have been drastic changes in the team or in the formation but I felt the change in attitude and tempo from the west ham game to the soton and stoke and then to the utd game shows that he is adapting to the opposition and that he had learnt from his past mistake. I admit he managed the side vs arse poorly, but it could have been worse or even better if not for the Rose fuck up
 
LillyCockerels said:
Sure they may not have been drastic changes in the team or in the formation but I felt the change in attitude and tempo from the west ham game to the soton and stoke and then to the utd game shows that he is adapting to the opposition and that he had learnt from his past mistake. I admit he managed the side vs arse poorly, but it could have been worse or even better if not for the Rose fuck up
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We will have to agree to disagree, I think he has approached each game in virtually the same way with performances differring on two basis
1) the opposition
2) Whether or not Capoue is playing
 
How many teams will lose
Lister said:
I havent seen anything to suggest he is learning, it seems to me he is still going about it the way he did against West Ham. Most noticable change was bringing in Capoue, which balanced things a lot better - but then at the weekend he went with no Capoue and nothing else to compensate defensively.

I want him to learn, and I hope to hell he does and fast - I hope in a few games time all this talk looks like folly - but Ive seen nothing so far to suggest that will happen...
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Defensively we will improve, when some player return from injury, i'm sure of it. I feel its the correct way forward to develop a team by creating a structure/formation that allows players to fit into it rather than create random formations with the players available (I hope that makes sense). Players like consistency and TS is giving them that. He's giving him self and the team every chance to suceed with how he is doing things I honestly believe it.
 
Consistency is only good if the formation (or matter at hand) works.
While Vertonghen may improve the back 4, he is still going to be mugged of again and again if the midfield in front of him continues to let teams attack at will.

1 of Sandro or Capoue are absolutely essential to balance this out. And if neither are available we need to compensate somehow, even if it means 5 in midfield.
 
Smoked Salmon said:
So flush the last trophy within realistic reach down the shitter?

No. AVB's downfall was his tactics, formation and internal politics.

True but I do believe levy would have struggled to pull the trigger if we were sitting in the top 4 a few points off the title.

That doesn't mean that the argument that they should be able to play two games within a week is invalid.
But this isn't an excuse. You say we should concentrate on Champion's League, but if we get into it we'll be playing often on Wednesdays and then Saturdays, with exactly the same amount of space between matches. Frankly I think a lot of players make excuses. Too tired? 180 minutes a week of actual competitive play? Please. These are supposed to be professionals.

It simply is not the same thing. I have heard Mourinho and wenger continually moan about fixtures and resting time. We went to Georgia, North Norway,Moldova and Russia. You couldn't have honestly asked for a more messed up europa set of fixtures in terms of distance travelled.And there are so many documented cases of teams with light squads destroying their league form in europe. Newcastle last year and liverpool comes to mind.And there is a stat that says 7 out of 8 of our last losses/points dropped come after a europa game.

We aren't rotating anymore under Timmy. If anything we are arguably rotating less. He's just playing different players in a different formation.

So, but this is a mind boggling comment. What manager would seek to get us eliminated from a competition that we have an outside chance of winning?We've only gotten fourth twice though. You want CL, you're not gonna get it with a squad of half a dozen new players, an intern for a manager and tactical naivity. So why throw away our last cup run?You mean the players you say are telling us they are far too tired to have to play another 90minutes a week?

Well this is what Sherwood just did, Look at the carling cup fixture. He took off Adebayor and Rose to protect them and have them fresh for the league.He prioritzed Manu game over Woolwich and rightfully so.I cannot see us holding onto vertonghen and Llloris with a europa cup. And the chances of that seem much less so given our goal scoring record at the moment.I have simply seen a pattern of performance dips that we cannot seem to manage after thursday nights

Dembele after westham defeat

“In the second half we looked very tired and not too much passion. These kind of games you have to win if you want to have a good season so it’s a shame.”

Aaron lennon

Had to grind the win out today, never easy after away European game but a wins a win, great to be back after 2 months out. #tiredlegs #coys
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Oh dear.........:paulinhobored::avbcringe:
 
Sanchez18 said:
I honestly believe we can be a top, top team in Europe in a few years. Playing 4-4-2 will not lead us to that. I'm hoping for De Boer in the summer or TS to go to a 4-3-3 and show me something........
.......
That is assuming we keep the players. Our team has so much potential and I don't want to waste it with the wrong manager. I thought AVB was the right man, and still believe he was. I have no idea if TS is. I haven't seen a single thing to lead me to believe he is.

I like TS playing the youth, but he has gone too far. Holtby, if available, must be playing over any youth player. Holtby is roughly the same age and is a far superior player.
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I'm a huge AVB fan, but I though he had to go at the end, we were playing atrocious football and he didn't have a way with motivating the players

What still makes you think he was the right man?
This is not a dig at all, I just want to know......
 
1882 said:
I'm still yet to find a Calender that shows Wednesday-Saturday is somehow a bigger gap than Thursday-Sunday!
If we were in the CL this season !!!!!!) don't you think we'd be having exactly the same problem? Except without the European win! We'd be coming back on Saturday, shellshocked at the mauling we took in the Nou Camp midweek!!!
If the players can't handle THIS, then they're gonna be fucked if we ever DO make the CL again....
Or does all the money and Faux opera music they play somehow compensate for not being able to play midweek-weekends throughout the season?

I've never quite got the logic behind fielding a weakened team in order to have one less competition to 'worry about'.... Competition (and occasionally winning the odd one) is surely WHY WE'RE ALL HERE!!!! No?
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Agree with the sentiments here, we should be going all in for cups.
But just wanted to point out that CL games are half on Tuesdays, and every chance the next PL game will be Sunday, so could be 3-4 day gap vs always 2 in Europa.
 
OffTheBench said:
Agree with the sentiments here, we should be going all in for cups.
But just wanted to point out that CL games are half on Tuesdays, and every chance the next PL game will be Sunday, so could be 3-4 day gap vs always 2 in Europa.
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DAMMIT!!! (bangs fist on keyboard at such an obvious oversight!) :dempsey:

....orders new keyboard! :avbcringe:
 
Josh Pauls said:
I agree,
To sum up the situation, Daniel Levy is moron who doesn't know what he wants
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I think he knows exactly what he wants. To win the league without spending a dime. I think he is incredibly impatient and tough, but in the long run for the better. We have improved so much by spending basically nothing. If he were to be more stable with managerial choices I think we will continue to progress.
 
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