Jose Mourinho

[John Thomas]

So what you're saying is that Levy agreed to spend over £130m on midfielders but told both Jose and Poch "You can't have a striker".

Can you explain exactly how that is even remotely plausible?

Why are you resorting to putting words in my mouth, mate.
You're better than that, I thought.

As I've said before. Other teams, those that win stuff, buy the players that make an immediate impact on the team.
They identify the gaps and weaknesses and address them.
We prioritise players based on resale value. I think it's highly likely we couldn't land a suitable striker that met that criteria.

And we didn't spend £130m on midfielders in January.

 

[TomHotspur]

United?????
They got a Chinese league reject, don't tell me that's the type of signing you want.
There were many teams after a striker.

It amazes me that people believe that Levy would sanction signing midfielder after midfielder and then tell Jose that he can't have a striker. Absolutely ridiculous and the height of "delusion".

Jose is a "yes man". Righto.
He knew what our transfer policy and budget was when he joined. As you said he'd literally just joined, so why would he be unhappy.

He thought we could manage with Son and Lucas filling in for Kane. It was just unfortunate that Son got injured after the TW closed.

Can you point out where anyone has said or claimed that Levy said to Mourinho “you can’t have a striker.” That, as you say, is not very plausible.
What is plausible though, is that not enough was done to address the issue by the recruitment staff and we were left short once again.
United signed a “Chinese reject” as you put him, but at least they did something to try and address the issue in comparison to our feeble attempts. And Ighalo has actually popped in a few goals for them too.

 

[stevee]

Why are you resorting to putting words in my mouth, mate.
You're better than that, I thought.

As I've said before. Other teams, those that win stuff, buy the players that make an immediate impact on the team.
They identify the gaps and weaknesses and address them.
We prioritise players based on resale value. I think it's highly likely we couldn't land a suitable striker that met that criteria.

And we didn't spend £130m on midfielders in January.

Words in your mouth?
You explicitly said that Jose AND his predecessor both wanted a striker but "their pleas fell on deaf ears"

We spent over £130m over the last 2 tw, when Jose and Poch were our managers.

So, I'll ask again, it what world is it plausible that Levy told both of them that they could spend money but they weren't allowed to buy a striker?

 

[skywalker68]

Can you point out where anyone has said or claimed that Levy said to Mourinho “you can’t have a striker.” That, as you say, is not very plausible.
What is plausible though, is that not enough was done to address the issue by the recruitment staff and we were left short once again.
United signed a “Chinese reject” as you put him, but at least they did something to try and address the issue in comparison to our feeble attempts. And Ighalo has actually popped in a few goals for them too.

The recruitment has been flawed for years one has to wonder why?
We hire these scouts and or DOFs yet none of them last more than a season or two, it does make you wonder if it's a case of promises are broken, or someone else at the club pulls the rug from under everyone's feet, I suspect a combination of the two.

 

[stevee]

Can you point out where anyone has said or claimed that Levy said to Mourinho “you can’t have a striker.” That, as you say, is not very plausible.
What is plausible though, is that not enough was done to address the issue by the recruitment staff and we were left short once again.
United signed a “Chinese reject” as you put him, but at least they did something to try and address the issue in comparison to our feeble attempts. And Ighalo has actually popped in a few goals for them too.

Igahlo scored 4 goals against vastly inferior opposition IIRC. 2 in the FA Cup and 2 in the Europa league.
He hasn't scored in the PL, indeed he's not considered good enough to start for them in the league.
A panic buy, or rather loan, exactly the thing that Jose said he didn't want.

 

[John Thomas]

Words in your mouth?
You explicitly said that Jose AND his predecessor both wanted a striker but "their pleas fell on deaf ears"

We spent over £130m over the last 2 tw, when Jose and Poch were our managers.

So, I'll ask again, it what world is it plausible that Levy told both of them that they could spend money but they weren't allowed to buy a striker?

No. Read my post properly. This is really poor form.

Of course he never explicitly told any of them they couldn't have a striker. Or midfielder. Or centre back. Or left back etc etc. But in the case of January, which is the window in question, it's blatantly obvious that Jose was desperate for a striker, and it failed to materialise.

Probably, like I said above, because one couldn't be identified that was either a) cheap enough for Levy to sanction or b) have the requiscent sell on value, for Levy to sanction.
So, once again, we came up short and opted to wing it through the season with square pegs in round holes. ( why do you think we have so much success off the pitch, and so little on it)

Only to then be eliminated from the CL, the FA cup, and probably the top 4 within weeks.

Just like NO transfers materialised for TWO successive windows despite the begging and pleading of his predecessor, Pochettino.

Are you actually saying that Jose himself prioritised strengthening midfield over a striker in January? Do you really believe that? With Kane being ruled out for the rest of the season?
If so, can you find a quote from January where he specifically said this?

 

[Brian Fantana]

I agree he wanted a striker. It’s the position we have had the least success in signing a player to play there since Berbatov. Even if we got in a player of the level of Pav for next season we’d be much better off.

 

[skywalker68]

I agree he wanted a striker. It’s the position we have had the least success in signing a player to play there since Berbatov. Even if we got in a player of the level of Pav for next season we’d be much better off.

Our problem is that when the subject of an additional striker is mentioned, a number of people will say that we can't buy another one because they won't sit on the bench.
Surely big clubs or ones that aspire to be, need or want quality back up in all positions in order to compete, for the past couple of years we have had issues when Kane gets his inevitable injury.

 

[Airfixx]

Our problem is that when the subject of an additional striker is mentioned, a number of people will say that we can't buy another one because they won't sit on the bench.
Surely big clubs or ones that aspire to be, need or want quality back up in all positions in order to compete, for the past couple of years we have had issues when Kane gets his inevitable injury.

1. I doubt message board rhetoric plays a part in our actual transfer strategy.

2. The 'bench' point is cited from an incoming player perspective. I doubt wholeheartedly that anyone here objects to the idea of a shit hot striker waiting in the wings.

 

[Brian Fantana]

Our problem is that when the subject of an additional striker is mentioned, a number of people will say that we can't buy another one because they won't sit on the bench.
Surely big clubs or ones that aspire to be, need or want quality back up in all positions in order to compete, for the past couple of years we have had issues when Kane gets his inevitable injury.

Well, they’re wrong!

 

[Airfixx]

Well, they’re wrong!

Tbf, it's more that they're being mis-quoted.

 

[skywalker68]

1. I doubt message board rhetoric plays a part in our actual transfer strategy.

2. The 'bench' point is cited from an incoming player perspective. I doubt wholeheartedly that anyone here objects to the idea of a shit hot striker waiting in the wings.

I agree mate that transfer strategy isn't based around forum opinion nor should it, but it does and has been mentioned previously not just on here but other forums that I visit.

 

[John Thomas]

. Even if we got in a player of the level of Pav for next season we’d be much better off.

But would they be happy to keep the bench warm each week until Kane gets injured?

 

[Airfixx]

I agree mate that transfer strategy isn't based around forum opinion nor should it, but it does and has been mentioned previously not just on here but other forums that I visit.

What has? That people simply don't want a 2nd ST?

 

[skywalker68]

What has? That people simply don't want a 2nd ST?

No what I said previously that no one will be prepared to play second fiddle to Kane, I think that good competition would be good for him and the club.
If Jose is to push on then he needs good tools at his disposal, although now there is no money about this will make it hard to do.

 

[Airfixx]

No what I said previously that no one will be prepared to play second fiddle to Kane, I think that good competition would be good for him and the club.
If Jose is to push on then he needs good tools at his disposal, although now there is no money about this will make it hard to do.

Your orig. post says that "our problem" is what some fans say about our predicament. Maybe you meant otherwise....... If you did, c'est la vie.

 

[stevee]

No. Read my post properly. This is really poor form.

Of course he never explicitly told any of them they couldn't have a striker. Or midfielder. Or centre back. Or left back etc etc. But in the case of January, which is the window in question, it's blatantly obvious that Jose was desperate for a striker, and it failed to materialise.

Probably, like I said above, because one couldn't be identified that was either a) cheap enough for Levy to sanction or b) have the requiscent sell on value, for Levy to sanction.
So, once again, we came up short and opted to wing it through the season with square pegs in round holes. ( why do you think we have so much success off the pitch, and so little on it)

Only to then be eliminated from the CL, the FA cup, and probably the top 4 within weeks.

Just like NO transfers materialised for TWO successive windows despite the begging and pleading of his predecessor, Pochettino.

Are you actually saying that Jose himself prioritised strengthening midfield over a striker in January? Do you really believe that? With Kane being ruled out for the rest of the season?
If so, can you find a quote from January where he specifically said this?

Ok, maybe I read this wrong?

Jose spent the whole of January begging, pleading for a striker. And, much like his predecessor, his pleas fell on deaf ears

The way I read this is that BOTH Poch AND José were looking for a striker and their "pleas fell on deaf ears" meaning that Levy refused or ignored their requests to buy a striker.
Maybe you can clarify if I've misunderstood?

As for quotes, how about this one from AFTER the window had shut.

José Mourinho says he ‘cannot lie’ after transfer window frustrations

José Mourinho says he ‘cannot lie’ after window frustrations at Tottenham, especially for a striker, but he does not blame Daniel Levy

www.theguardian.com

“I cannot hide. If I say it’s easy to play three competitions without a striker, I’m going to lie. I cannot lie. But if it’s not possible, it’s not possible. For me the great thing is that we’re all together on this in the club. There’s nobody to blame. We don’t want a striker to just help us now. We want a striker to be good for our future, possibly to play with Harry Kane together in the future. And with the difficulties of the market, it was very, very difficult to find [one].”

Note the things he actually says :
I cannot lie
Nobody to blame
We don't want a striker to just help us now
Play with Harry in the future
Difficulties of the market.

It's funny how you believe all of the quotes that suits your agenda but you don't believe this one.

I know we've gone through this before but as you keep repeating your "facts", I'll keep repeating my question :

Can you provide the quotes (any qoute) where Jose says he was "desperate/begging/pleading" for a striker?

Also why is it that the other clubs looking for a striker in January failed to get one?
Is that Levy's fault too?

Caveat :
Ighalo don't count, a player only good enough to be a backup, something Jose explicitly said he didn't want.

 

[John Thomas]

Ok, maybe I read this wrong?




The way I read this is that BOTH Poch AND José were looking for a striker and their "pleas fell on deaf ears" meaning that Levy refused or ignored their requests to buy a striker.
Maybe you can clarify if I've misunderstood?

As for quotes, how about this one from AFTER the window had shut.

José Mourinho says he ‘cannot lie’ after transfer window frustrations

José Mourinho says he ‘cannot lie’ after window frustrations at Tottenham, especially for a striker, but he does not blame Daniel Levy

www.theguardian.com

“I cannot hide. If I say it’s easy to play three competitions without a striker, I’m going to lie. I cannot lie. But if it’s not possible, it’s not possible. For me the great thing is that we’re all together on this in the club. There’s nobody to blame. We don’t want a striker to just help us now. We want a striker to be good for our future, possibly to play with Harry Kane together in the future. And with the difficulties of the market, it was very, very difficult to find [one].”

Note the things he actually says :
I cannot lie
Nobody to blame
We don't want a striker to just help us now
Play with Harry in the future
Difficulties of the market.

It's funny how you believe all of the quotes that suits your agenda but you don't believe this one.

I know we've gone through this before but as you keep repeating your "facts", I'll keep repeating my question :

Can you provide the quotes (any qoute) where Jose says he was "desperate/begging/pleading" for a striker?

Also why is it that the other clubs looking for a striker in January failed to get one?
Is that Levy's fault too?

Caveat :
Ighalo don't count, a player only good enough to be a backup, something Jose explicitly said he didn't want.

We can go back and forth all year on this. We've already clogged up numerous other threads doing exactly that.
It's probably fair to say the rest of the forum don't wish to see the same old argument regurgitated by the same old voices, so I'll just sign off from the debate with the following.

When we went into January with Harry Kane ruled out for the season, every one to a man thought it inconceivable we would come out the other side without a replacement. After all, that's why the window exists.

And yet, it happened. That's the only uncontestable fact in the whole sorry affair

Everything else is up for conjecture. How we percieve the events and to whom we apportion blame is down to the individual.

From my point of view, Jose spent the whole of January virtually begging for this position to be strengthened knowing we still had interest in 3 major competitions ahead.
I think he was badly let down, just like his predecessors, but was hardly going to openly criticise his paymaster just 3 months into his job.

You think otherwise, and nothing I say will change your mind.

There's absolutely no point in continuing the debate.

 

[stevee]

We can go back and forth all year on this. We've already clogged up numerous other threads doing exactly that.
It's probably fair to say the rest of the forum don't wish to see the same old argument regurgitated by the same old voices, so I'll just sign off from the debate with the following.

When we went into January with Harry Kane ruled out for the season, every one to a man thought it inconceivable we would come out the other side without a replacement. After all, that's why the window exists.

And yet, it happened. That's the only uncontestable fact in the whole sorry affair

Everything else is up for conjecture. How we percieve the events and to whom we apportion blame is down to the individual.

From my point of view, Jose spent the whole of January virtually begging for this position to be strengthened knowing we still had interest in 3 major competitions ahead.
I think he was badly let down, just like his predecessors, but was hardly going to openly criticise his paymaster just 3 months into his job.

You think otherwise, and nothing I say will change your mind.

There's absolutely no point in continuing the debate.

So, no answer to my questions and no quotes from Jose showing he was "begging/pleading/desperate/on his knees" then.

Fair enough, we'll leave it at that.

 

[John Thomas]

So, no answer to my questions and no quotes from Jose showing he was "begging/pleading/desperate/on his knees" then.

Fair enough, we'll leave it at that.

Of course he didn't use the words I'm begging you Daniel. Of course he wasnt on his knees in the literal sense.



This is childish stuff, stevee, and you know it.



His constant bemoaning of our lack of striking options, in virtually every pre and post match interview, was, in my opinion, a desparate plea to his chairman. Who, true to form, failed him.

But you think spending money on midfielders proves otherwise.

Fair enough. We'll leave it at that